Episode 8: Becoming a Therapy Animal Team with @MagnusTheTherapyDog & Transforming Raw Diets for Pets

Disclaimer: Our podcast is produced as an audio resource. Transcripts are generated using speech recognition software and human editing and may contain errors. Before republishing quotes, we ask that you reference the audio.

00:00:00:01 - 00:00:27:19
Chris
Pets Add Life. Your guide to the latest in pet trends, products and the joy of the human animal bond. With Kristen Levine and Chris Bonifati powered by the American Pet Products Association and Dog TV.

Hey there Kristen, it's another another beautiful Tuesday. Time for another episode of the Pal podcast. I'm Chris. I'm joined, as always, by Kristen Levine.

00:00:27:21 - 00:00:39:05
Chris
We're the pals. We're going to be taking you through a couple of, great stories, some great product, some great guests. And at the end, we're going to answer some of your questions. Kristen, how are you feeling today?

00:00:39:10 - 00:00:44:11
Kristen
I'm feeling great, but I'm also a little nervous about something.

00:00:44:13 - 00:00:45:15
Chris
What could that possibly be?

00:00:45:20 - 00:01:05:01
Kristen
Well, I'm excited because I'm going to Las Vegas tomorrow to celebrate my aunt's birthday. Okay, but my dog tulip is staying with a new pet sitter. Ooh. So. And she's great. I think she's great. She came with a really great recommendation. She came over yesterday. We went through the whole routine. but, you know, it's still a little bit.

00:01:05:03 - 00:01:08:01
Kristen
You know, I'm a nervous dog. Mom, what can I say?

00:01:08:03 - 00:01:29:17
Chris
It's anxiety inducing, actually. My parents. Hi, mom. If you're listening. Hi, mom. my parents live in a pretty remote area, and they recently had to find, somebody to watch the dog. And it's not as easy as when you live in a city and there's options. so, yes, I felt that secondhand anxiety pretty, personally, as as well.

00:01:29:18 - 00:01:32:10
Chris
best best of luck, but. Well, thank.

00:01:32:12 - 00:01:42:16
Kristen
You. Should be fine. And I, I've instructed her to send me text messages at least five times a day with photos, so that will make me feel better. But but meanwhile, I.

00:01:42:18 - 00:02:00:22
Chris
I get that too. I get the same way with the cat. And people think I'm a freak because they're like, it's a cat. Like, you don't even need a cat sitter. Like they just need somebody that comes in and dumps the food and leaves, and I request pictures, I request videos, I request voice memos from from the cat.

00:02:00:22 - 00:02:03:14
Chris
Excuse me? Confirming sounds.

00:02:03:16 - 00:02:07:04
Kristen
You're you're just a modern day. You're modern day cat. Dad.

00:02:07:06 - 00:02:09:22
Chris
That's exactly what I am. I'm a modern day cat.

00:02:10:00 - 00:02:29:04
Kristen
Yes. So, so modern day cat, dad. And I'm obviously modern day dog mom. but today's part is cool because we are talking to an internet celebrity, and we're also talking to a PhD in companion animal nutrition. So we're going to learn a lot about feeding our pets.

00:02:29:06 - 00:02:45:14
Chris
That's that's amazing. Yeah, these were both great interviews. But before that, I think we're going to give you guys a couple of stories from from the news. So, without further ado, let's get right into that. Kristen and Chris present story time.

00:02:45:16 - 00:03:09:21
Kristen
Okeydoke. I'll go first with my story. And this is a this is actually a common story, Chris. We we hear it from time to time on the news, and it's always a great, feel good story. But yet another dog who was lost was found 2000 miles away. So this is Misha. Misha is, I forget what breed of dog she was, but she wandered away from her family's auto repair shop in San Diego.

00:03:09:23 - 00:03:23:00
Kristen
This is back in July of 2023. And lo and behold, if she wasn't discovered near Detroit just about a week ago, and it was all because of a microchip.

00:03:23:02 - 00:03:24:23
Chris
To 2000, you said 2000.

00:03:25:02 - 00:03:30:22
Kristen
2000. Yeah. And they have no idea how Mika got from San Diego to Detroit.

00:03:31:00 - 00:03:51:02
Chris
And how long? How long was eight months? Eight months? Eight. So eight months, 2000 miles. That's that's that's. I'm going to have to do the math. Did anybody in my ear tell me the distance between San Diego and Detroit? Now that's it. And it's that's an insane amount of distance. And how did they end up finding the dog ship situation?

00:03:51:02 - 00:04:10:01
Kristen
Yeah, she was, Mika was picked up by a local animal shelter in the Detroit area, and they scanned her for a microchip. And sure enough, the microchip traced her back to her home in San Diego. So, but, you know, I mean, first of all, it's great that she had a microchip because she would never have been reunited if she hadn't had one.

00:04:10:01 - 00:04:10:23
Chris
Yes, but.

00:04:10:23 - 00:04:34:07
Kristen
I can't, you know, I, I preach about this a lot on my blog over at Pet Letting, but it's so simple to put an identification tag on your dog because somebody finds your dog. All they have to do is read the tag and call yourself, and that the reunion happens a lot faster. But you know, so I always say the tag and or a tracking device, plus a microchip, that's a trifecta.

00:04:34:07 - 00:04:41:12
Kristen
That's that's the best practice you can do to make sure your dog gets returned to you if they become lost.

00:04:41:14 - 00:04:56:12
Chris
I mean, that's such an incredible story. And, I mean, it really goes to show you that dogs are still animals. and animals have the call of the wild, right? They have a way with nature. and my story actually takes away from that a little bit.

00:04:56:14 - 00:04:57:20
Kristen
What is it? So,

00:04:57:22 - 00:05:20:18
Chris
I, I want to talk about science. I am here to discuss science. So I read an article recently about a study, in, dog food, health and nutrition. and the study has shown that dogs have actually evolved to be able to thrive on plant based diets. So we're just saying, yeah, call the wild. The dog can survive.

00:05:20:18 - 00:05:48:17
Chris
But, the human animal bond, as it's developed over the years, and our selective breeding and, just the way that we've domesticated dogs has actually fundamentally changed the gut bacteria, the diets and, this study has shown the genetics of the animals to be able to thrive on more plant based diets. So, right there was a really big trend in raw, carnivorous diets for dogs.

00:05:48:17 - 00:06:16:21
Chris
And that still may be a great option. but studies are showing that dogs can thrive on plant based diets. I mean, I know that my family's dog loves carrots, right? Loves carrots as a snack, loves sweet potato based treats and things like that. and it's actually possible for some dogs to survive entirely on, plant and grain based diets now, which is is an incredibly new finding.

00:06:16:23 - 00:06:39:19
Chris
in previous research, according to the article, has shown that dogs require some type of meat based protein, mostly for the macro amino acids that help them, actually process that protein. but just like everything else on the face of this planet, things are changing. dogs are changing. Accessing to, to to, humans and and our trends.

00:06:39:19 - 00:06:48:15
Kristen
So did the article. Did the article say how much time? Like how much time that's taken for dogs? Diet needs to evolve.

00:06:48:17 - 00:07:12:08
Chris
It does not. but this is personally, this is the first, study I've seen to show this. So how long have humans domesticated dogs for, so unless they're, they haven't been looking into this. But I'm sure with all of the different pet food and treat companies that have been popping up, there has been some money pumping into researching, canine nutrition.

00:07:12:10 - 00:07:21:15
Chris
this may be the first time that they've actually identified the the, the plant proteins, that are acceptable for dog nutrition.

00:07:21:15 - 00:07:26:14
Kristen
Yeah. That's awesome. Let's let's include that in the show notes in case anybody wants to read that.

00:07:26:16 - 00:07:43:15
Chris
Absolutely. I will include both the article and the study itself. For those of you who like to dive into those, seek out primary sources. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I love reading a scientific article because it makes me feel stupid. Well, yeah. Yeah, honestly.

00:07:43:17 - 00:07:45:16
Kristen
It sounds smart to you, but it.

00:07:45:18 - 00:08:06:04
Chris
Oh, yeah. Absolutely. But that's because I read the news. The news article. I opened up the scientific article, the Cliff notes halfway through when I was like, these guys. Whoa. science is tough. so all the scientists out there listening, your job is hard. I just get on to a microphone and talk, and maybe. Maybe I'll answer a few emails.

00:08:06:06 - 00:08:09:08
Chris
you guys are doing the real work out there.

00:08:09:10 - 00:08:11:19
Kristen
Great story. Love it.

00:08:11:21 - 00:08:18:15
Chris
Yeah. And I think, we're going to go straight into some interviews. Right. Who do you want to introduce? Our first guest, Kristen.

00:08:18:15 - 00:08:39:23
Kristen
Yeah, sure. So we got to sit down with Brian Benson and Magnus, the therapy dog. they are internet famous, over a million followers on Instagram. And I'm sure other platforms too. But it was really cool because both you and I, before we met Brian and Magnus, we had already seen him in our feed, so we're already following it.

00:08:39:23 - 00:08:58:19
Chris
I think at the time of recording it, 1.1 million followers on Instagram. just an amazing animal. An amazing animal handler. and yeah, let's listen in, and hear that interview, Beyond the Leash exploring the untold stories of pet passion and professionalism. Yeah, I think we're being joined by a guest.

00:08:58:19 - 00:09:08:14
Kristen
A very special mega star, Mac Magnus and Brian Benson, famous on Instagram. Over a million followers.

00:09:08:14 - 00:09:16:22
Chris
Yeah, I've never done a million of anything. So a million followers. That's quite the large, number. Thank you for joining us. It's, a real honor.

00:09:17:00 - 00:09:24:04
Kristen
We we reached out to of last minute yesterday, and you agreed to do the show. And we know you're super busy with Magnus, and, we're we're so excited to have you.

00:09:24:06 - 00:09:26:08
Brian
Oh, it's my pleasure. Absolutely. Thank you.

00:09:26:10 - 00:09:34:18
Kristen
It's funny, when I. When I heard that we were going to be talking to Brian, I checked my Instagram feed. I'm like, oh, yeah. I've seen this guy. That guy. Yeah.

00:09:34:19 - 00:09:36:02
Brian
I love.

00:09:36:02 - 00:09:37:22
Kristen
That. So do you get recognized all the time.

00:09:37:22 - 00:09:55:03
Brian
Like we do? Actually, it's weird because we do a lot of traveling. So we've done cross country road trips, different road trips all over the country, and we get noticed in random states, in random cities. And it's very humbling because you don't expect it. So people say, oh my God, is that Magnus? And my first thought is, how do you know who my dog is?

00:09:55:03 - 00:10:11:00
Brian
Because I don't connect it to the social media, because I'm just in my own world. I'm thinking, are you stalking me, following me? And then I connect the dots. And thank you so much. I really appreciate it. And, you know, you start talking to followers and fans and then it's amazing and it's fantastic. But the first moment you're wondering, how do you know who I am?

00:10:11:00 - 00:10:12:04
Brian
It's surreal. You know.

00:10:12:06 - 00:10:13:16
Kristen
It's like a there's a creepy moment.

00:10:13:16 - 00:10:15:12
Brian
Yeah. But then it's then it's an amazing moment.

00:10:15:13 - 00:10:15:18
Kristen
And then.

00:10:15:23 - 00:10:28:14
Chris
Yeah, well, he very may be the most famous therapy dog on the planet. So why don't you tell us a bit about, what it means to be a therapy dog? What is Magnus's skill set? What's he particularly good at?

00:10:28:16 - 00:10:48:18
Brian
Sure. So we are a pet therapy team. We've been doing this since 2018, and we visit hospitals, schools, nursing homes, community crisis centers. And we focus on hospitals because as a child, I spent a lot of time in a hospital. I remember how to sterile and cold and miserable. The experience was. So when I found out my therapy dog work, I was thinking, oh, this is a great way to pay it forward and give back.

00:10:48:20 - 00:11:14:15
Brian
So we visit hospitals, children and adults who are terminally ill. So it's a very tough population because the people we visit, unfortunately they're never leaving. And if they do leave, they're enough to come home. But they go back for like, you know, several weeks or several months at a time. So our job as a therapy team is really help their emotional, mental and physical well-being and just kind of right their, their day lift their spirits, make them smile and be that distraction from all the pain in their life.

00:11:14:17 - 00:11:22:03
Brian
And he is amazing. Magnus is just incredible, just making people happy. And it's what he does. It's just hard wired into his DNA.

00:11:22:05 - 00:11:34:15
Chris
That's actually, amazing work. Is this something that, you know, you had this idea and you wanted to have a therapy dog, and you went out looking for one specific. Or do you get Magnus and immediately realize, wow, he simply has that touch?

00:11:34:19 - 00:11:51:15
Brian
No. It's interesting. So I adopted Magnus as just to be our family pet. I've had dogs my entire life. I'm that guy who always said I'm always going to have a dog. But unfortunately, my oldest daughter, Riley, has very severe arthritis. And we adopted Magnus's year and a half. And I'd have to give my daughter daily injections. Weekly injections.

00:11:51:15 - 00:12:12:03
Brian
She was 11 at the time, very traumatic and she would be very anxious and very stressed out. She would cry and Magnus on his own with no training, new to just comfort her. It was just this innate ability. He had to just make sure she was okay and I that light bulb went off. That, oh, he's meant for something bigger, something more, something better.

00:12:12:05 - 00:12:23:04
Brian
So I started doing research. I found out about therapy dog work organizations in my area. We became, certified. And now it's been again since 2018 that we've been trying to make people feel better, like he did with my daughter.

00:12:23:06 - 00:12:25:03
Chris
Yeah. That's an that's an amazing story.

00:12:25:03 - 00:12:37:13
Kristen
Yeah, yeah. I'm curious to know when you. The Magnus is seeing other dogs outside the podcast studio here for guys like, I want to make some friends. I'm curious to know how you became an influencer. When did when did that enter the.

00:12:37:13 - 00:13:00:13
Brian
Picture that happened? It was a very happy accident because of Covid. Like a lot of people, I do TV and film for 30 years, visual effects artist and Kobe happened work stopped, our therapy dog work stopped. So there's no in-person visits. I wanted to find somebody who just could still pay it forward, make people smile. So as a goof, I started an Instagram account just to make people smile with fun, happy dog pictures.

00:13:00:13 - 00:13:19:08
Brian
And it went from pictures to videos. And then videos started going viral. We won. Good Morning America, people magazine, time magazine, ESPN and it started to just blow up. I had friends in Europe. Brian, I think I saw your dog on TV. And then news outlets started to pick it up and I realized, oh, this is not just a passion project and a side thing.

00:13:19:08 - 00:13:25:15
Brian
I could actually really do this full time and try to make people happy. You know, with my, my best buddy.

00:13:25:17 - 00:13:30:22
Chris
Yeah. That's great. Why do you think people are so drawn towards your content?

00:13:31:00 - 00:13:56:06
Brian
I think because it's unfortunately a lot of darkness in the world and we try to do very light hearted, family friendly, fun content to just make you smile. And it's either skits, you know, involving Magnus or I have two teenage daughters and things that are relatable to people that they can resonate with, and we get these DMs from people all over the world saying, you know, I'm depressed or I have something work or family stuff or just pain in my life that they just need that break from the every day.

00:13:56:08 - 00:14:02:15
Brian
And Magnus is that great. He is that light that they look to, just to just kind of give them just that distraction that's.

00:14:02:17 - 00:14:07:18
Kristen
Well, and also to I think a lot of it has to do the fact that you are an amazing girl, dad.

00:14:07:20 - 00:14:10:12
Brian
You have you got it. I appreciate that. And they're pretty amazing.

00:14:10:12 - 00:14:18:18
Kristen
Yeah. And they're frequently featured in your content. And I think that really endears it certainly endears women to you and to Magnus, of course.

00:14:18:20 - 00:14:20:18
Brian
Yeah, that's pretty great, I agree. Yeah.

00:14:20:20 - 00:14:37:11
Chris
So what if, you know, we got some listeners out there who are hearing about, Magnus. They've always wanted to, a adopt a dog, bring a new dog into their family and are thinking, well, I want to train my dog as a service dog or a therapy dog. I've heard some of my friends talking about that often.

00:14:37:11 - 00:14:40:05
Chris
Do you have any advice for anybody who might be in that position?

00:14:40:06 - 00:14:57:03
Brian
Sure. I mean, there's certain things that before you become a therapy dog, I can just speak for my experience that your dog has to have. So your dog, before you go into a therapy dog program, they have to have really tight obedience training, basic training. They shouldn't jump up on people. They shouldn't bark unless it's just for a specific command or task.

00:14:57:05 - 00:15:11:18
Brian
So before you can even get evaluated into that program, your dog has to be really dialed in. A lot of people don't realize that the therapy dog program, it's not a training program in the traditional sense. So they're not teaching dog how to said stay down, walk on a leash. They're teaching you how to behave in a therapy environment.

00:15:11:18 - 00:15:28:07
Brian
What to expect. Things you can say are things you cannot say. You know, for example, when I visit these terminally ill patients, I don't go in and say, how are you? Something you naturally say to a person just out of politeness and kindness? Or when I leave, I don't say, I'll see you soon because unfortunately they may not be there.

00:15:28:09 - 00:15:45:14
Brian
So they it's really kind of, you know, to mannerisms, your awareness. And they also make sure your dog is really dialed in to perform in these very high stress situations, because it can be other dogs who are also working in these hospitals, for example, or it is very, very chaotic scenes with doctors and nurses running in because of this.

00:15:45:15 - 00:16:01:23
Brian
You know, we go to the trauma ICU. So before you decide to be therapy dog, your dog has to be somewhat bulletproof and really distraction proof and really just be okay with the chaos and having, of course, strangers pet them and kind of, you know, touch them all over and be comfortable in every type of environment.

00:16:02:04 - 00:16:05:16
Chris
It seems like Magnus kind of has the dog equivalent of a PhD.

00:16:05:18 - 00:16:06:18
Brian
Pretty much. Yeah.

00:16:06:20 - 00:16:07:14
Chris
A lot of school.

00:16:07:14 - 00:16:09:23
Brian
Yeah, yeah, he's done quite a bit of work. Yeah. It's incredible.

00:16:09:23 - 00:16:13:19
Kristen
Yeah. What did you call him earlier before we started recording? Because he's so chill.

00:16:13:21 - 00:16:21:18
Brian
He's like walking value. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. For a walking stuffed animal. Yeah. He was like, nothing fazes him. He is bulletproof in that sense. Words. He's just go with the flow.

00:16:21:18 - 00:16:30:02
Kristen
He. Yeah. Some of my favorite posts of yours are the ones where you know, your positioning him to make it look like he just got in that position himself. Yeah. He's so cool. You just. He does whatever.

00:16:30:05 - 00:16:47:10
Brian
He's very prominent because it goes to trust also. Yes. Like I've spent so much time. We're together 24 seven. So we have that bond and that trust where we almost nobody comes up thinking, you know, he could read my mind. I can read his in a sense. And you know, he, he trust that I'm not going to put him in any position that won't get him hurt or put him in an uncomfortable situation.

00:16:47:12 - 00:16:48:07
Brian
Right. Which is great.

00:16:48:09 - 00:16:54:00
Kristen
Awesome. So where can folks follow you if they're not already, if they're one of the very few people that are following you yet.

00:16:54:02 - 00:17:09:06
Brian
Hopefully they are. But magnet therapy dog and we're everywhere. Instagram, TikTok, Facebook, YouTube, Snapchat, Pinterest even. And we also just launched a dog training community because a lot of people reach out to us and say, how can I get my dog to listen like Magnus does? So we're trying to help those people as well.

00:17:09:07 - 00:17:16:20
Chris
And I'm sure they'll be some special Global Pet Expo themed posts in our near future. All right, so everybody be on the lookout for those, too.

00:17:16:22 - 00:17:23:04
Kristen
Yeah, absolutely. Thank you so much for taking some time out this morning to to chat with us. And it was great to meet you and Magnus and your beautiful daughter Skyler.

00:17:23:04 - 00:17:28:15
Brian
And my pleasure. Yeah. Thank you, thank you, thank you. All right.

00:17:28:17 - 00:17:42:04
Kristen
Yeah. I really enjoyed meeting him. And his. One of his daughters was there in the studio with us, and she was, you know, shooting all the footage and, you know, making sure she got all the shots and they, they posted about in doing the podcast a couple days afterwards.

00:17:42:06 - 00:18:03:11
Chris
Oh, that's amazing. And what's great is it's a whole family ordeal. Brian really gets his family involved in, the therapy dog. I don't I don't even want to call it a business. That sounds like a dirty word. that therapy dog work, which is really great to expose, young folks to that, and the meaning behind it, because that's really impactful work.

00:18:03:13 - 00:18:12:06
Chris
but, I mean, starstruck meeting a celebrity, it's not every day you get to meet a celebrity dog like that, and they're kind of taking over the world. It's it's insane.

00:18:12:07 - 00:18:14:14
Kristen
I know they are. They are.

00:18:14:16 - 00:18:32:09
Chris
But part of me wants. Part of me wants to be like, it's it's so weird. But then the other part of me is up at one in the morning, scrolling through Instagram, watching all of these dogs and cats do stuff. So, I mean, who am I to really Pooh Pooh it, right? Like, it's it's just it's just the way the world works now and they're awesome.

00:18:32:09 - 00:18:34:15
Chris
It's so cool to see stuff like that.

00:18:34:17 - 00:18:42:13
Kristen
Yeah, it really is. And, you know, we can't help but it's it's entertaining. And, you know, when you love animals, you can't get enough.

00:18:42:15 - 00:18:44:15
Chris
Exactly. So. Exactly.

00:18:44:17 - 00:18:57:07
Kristen
I got to do a solo interview with Doctor James Templeman. He is with Primal Pet Foods, and he is a, He has a PhD in companion animal nutrition. So let's listen in.

00:18:57:07 - 00:19:02:02
Chris
Beyond the Leash exploring the untold stories of pet passion and professionalism.

00:19:02:04 - 00:19:09:04
Kristen
You know, I love doing the show for Global Pet Expo because we get to sit down in person when people like Doctor James Templeman. It's great to see you.

00:19:09:05 - 00:19:17:07
James
Yeah, great to see you as well. I'm really excited to be here and just get a chance to talk to you about some of the stuff that we're doing here at global, and some of the other things we're seeing around the show.

00:19:17:08 - 00:19:30:06
Kristen
Yeah, and I've had a chance to talk to you a few times now, and I'm excited for you to tell us about, Primal Pet Foods. Kibble in the raw. We're getting we're going to get to that in a minute, but I'd like to hear a little bit more about your background. And what is your role at primal pet food?

00:19:30:11 - 00:20:06:13
James
Yeah, absolutely. so I came to primal, I think it was January of 2022. So it's been a couple of years now under my belt. and I came to primal, actually, out of about 12 years in academia. So I spent a dozen years at the University of Guelph in Ontario. for those of you who are unfamiliar with some of the Canadian universities, of course, and during my time there, I did my bachelors, my masters, my PhD, as well as a postdoctoral fellowship, with the latter two degrees being very focused on companion meal, nutrition, more specifically looking at protein, amino acid metabolism, which again, in the world of raw and minimally processed

00:20:06:13 - 00:20:29:12
James
pet food proteins, the be all and all. So it was a very fitting way for me to kind of find my way into the industry. And it's been a pretty wild ride with primal ever since. I am, I think, now the director of nutrition and formulation here, I always stumble over my own title. but when people ask me what my role is, I usually respond with a bit of a Swiss Army knife for some degree.

00:20:29:14 - 00:20:59:00
James
well, our team is very focused on ensuring the nutritional compliance of every single product. That leaves one of our manufacturing facilities and ends up on a retail store shelf. I also do have a lot of interactions with pretty much every team across our department or across our, our company. So I have interactions with our marketing and sales teams, our procurement and supply chain, and then obviously a big role that we play within our food safety and quality control department, where my nutrition team kind of is nestled.

00:20:59:00 - 00:21:01:13
Kristen
Within gotcha you. So you truly are a Swiss Army knife.

00:21:01:13 - 00:21:04:02
James
Yeah, yeah. Kind of playing all the different roles and different.

00:21:04:02 - 00:21:05:01
Kristen
Hands on different.

00:21:05:03 - 00:21:09:00
James
Information to be dangerous. Yeah. In every situation that I'm placed in. And then.

00:21:09:02 - 00:21:13:20
Kristen
Yeah, I'm just curious what led to your interest in in pet food?

00:21:13:22 - 00:21:39:06
James
Yeah. I mean, I grew up on a farm, with every single animal that you possibly could have come across. But I always gravitated towards our working dogs. we grew up with border collies. I love them, and I still love them. One of them, a collie, just passed the window here, and it catches my eye. So I always told myself I'd work with dogs in some way, shape or form, and it just kind of turned out to be a very coincidental path.

00:21:39:06 - 00:22:11:21
James
Where I landed at the University of Guelph. Nutrition became my passion, and I got a, very unique opportunity to do a PhD in the animal nutrition, which is very unique across the series. so I'm grateful for my opportunity. And then when I got a chance to work for, emerging company like primal that was very set on creating nutritious and healthful food, but doing it in a way that was by science and backed by research and validated the performance of these products, is just everything that I wanted out of my first role in industry, and it's been a really exciting last couple of years.

00:22:11:21 - 00:22:19:14
Kristen
That's fantastic, but we're so lucky to have you in the pet industry, and you are a true pet loving family, because I just learned that your wife is going to be a veterinary surgeon.

00:22:19:14 - 00:22:39:18
James
Yes, yes. I always like to say we're both glutton for punishment when it comes to our time and universities. but she is, DVM and she's about two years away from completing her, her residency in soft tissue surgery. So we're both very animal, enthused animal lovers. We have a home that's already got more cats than humans in it.

00:22:39:18 - 00:22:48:14
James
So, it's been a pretty, fun environment for us to, for us to be in. And it's nice to be in the animal industry without necessarily being in each other's industry.

00:22:48:14 - 00:22:49:06
Kristen
Right? Right.

00:22:49:10 - 00:22:50:09
James
Keeps conversations a.

00:22:50:13 - 00:22:52:00
Kristen
Very complementary profession.

00:22:52:01 - 00:22:55:05
James
Exactly. Doesn't have to be your time. Conversations are always pretty interesting.

00:22:55:06 - 00:22:59:21
Kristen
So I guess the most important thing we can do for our pets is provide great veterinary care and also great nutrition.

00:22:59:21 - 00:23:03:20
James
Absolutely. It starts with nutrition and it usually ends in a vet clinic.

00:23:03:20 - 00:23:15:02
Kristen
Right. So let's talk about primal pet foods. Let's say you have something new that you're launching at the show called kibble in the RA. Can you talk to us about what what is kibble in the Raw and why are you so excited about it?

00:23:15:02 - 00:23:41:10
James
Yeah, yeah. I mean, personally, I'm excited for it because it's been a ton of work. It's been three plus years in the making pretty much for my entire time that I've been at primal in some way, shape or form. I've been helping to move this project along. It's been a really exciting venture for us, really to see it through to fruition where it is now, seeing product on store shelves, seeing product at this expo, it's been just a really crazy ride, but it's really been rewarding.

00:23:41:10 - 00:24:02:04
James
The last couple of months especially. It's we really have always been set up with the idea of bringing healthy and nutritious and raw and fresh food to as many pets as we possibly can, and we always understand that there's a barrier in terms of some of the consumer, some of the pet parents, that we can't always necessarily speak to on a 1 to 1 basis with raw foods.

00:24:02:06 - 00:24:37:01
James
there's a lot of convenience and familiarity that comes with kibble. and we know that we know a lot of the pet parents out there feeding kibble as a primary base. So we thought about a different way that we can try and lend a bit of a bridge and bridge. That gap between the two and, and kibble in the raw was really that way for us to do so, to bring true freeze dried, raw nutrition, but in a format that's very recognizable and in a, you know, feeding experience that's recognizable and very similar to what those, you know, kibble dedicated, households had always been used to.

00:24:37:01 - 00:25:04:00
James
Right. Also, most importantly, we understand that cost is a challenge for everybody in this day and age. That's right. Everything seems to be so expensive. So us being able to bring raw, whole food, nutrition at a cost point that's a little bit more, or a little bit less, I guess, of a sticker shock. Some are used to, if they're coming from a freeze dried or raw frozen background, it just kind of melded all of those different pieces together and came up with what we anticipated to be a great product.

00:25:04:00 - 00:25:21:14
James
But what really is just kind of been better than we ever could have imagined. And also on top of that, we've been able to and, you know, go down the sponsored research pathway to really try and show and validate the performance of this product, with empirical data. Right. I'm a scientist, so I'm always going to be a data driven guy.

00:25:21:14 - 00:25:24:10
James
Right. So it's been a nice way for me to combine those two aspects.

00:25:24:12 - 00:25:28:09
Kristen
And that's why it's taken partly why it's taken three years to get.

00:25:28:12 - 00:25:57:17
James
To this developmental stage is because it was a very complex process for us to wrap our head around from a manufacturing standpoint. Not that it's all that different in manufacturing technology to our previous products, but some of the inputs are a little bit different. But also, we were very dedicated to want to show and prove its performance, not just with us going out and talking everybody's ear off about it, but actually being able to have validated data, that actually now exists in reviews publish formats.

00:25:57:17 - 00:26:02:16
Kristen
Right. And then you don't have to rely on marketing necessarily. You've got the data to it.

00:26:02:17 - 00:26:06:03
James
We had some tools to marketing that they can use that actually has some science.

00:26:06:03 - 00:26:07:05
Kristen
To back exactly.

00:26:07:05 - 00:26:07:13
James
The best of.

00:26:07:13 - 00:26:20:11
Kristen
Both worlds. So do you envision that kibble in the Raw is going to appeal to that? That group of pet parents has maybe been interested in feeding raw, but hasn't dip their toe into it yet because they perceive, you know, the cost to be a barrier in that setting.

00:26:20:15 - 00:26:39:04
James
Yeah, yeah. No it again, it's just that way for us to get into those few more pet parents that are maybe, you know, maybe they're turned away from raw because they think everything is frozen raw, that they freezer space for, that they need to prepare and thaw ahead of time. Or maybe they think of raw as freeze dried only, which is so costly.

00:26:39:04 - 00:27:00:17
James
And or maybe they have a 6070, 80 pound dog where the idea of feeding a freeze dried nugget based diet just is astronomical and cost. Yeah. So trying to find that middle ground and again, we're not saying that every pet parent is now going to have a full bowl of just kibble on the Raw or their pets move forward, but it's just a way for us to introduce some raw, fresh food into them.

00:27:00:19 - 00:27:07:22
Kristen
And that was you read my mind because that was my next question. Is, is kibble in the raw? Could it be used as a topper or a tree?

00:27:07:22 - 00:27:33:08
James
Just kind of. Absolutely. Again, I like as a nutritionist, I always advocate for appropriate feeding. So if you are going to be introducing a new topper or a new treat, maybe there's kibble in the raw. Being that training treat or that topper, just to be cognizant of how much you're feeding and making sure that you are, kind of developing or programing the diet management of your pet to, you know, account for that extra calorie, that extra nutrition that comes from your treat and topper.

00:27:33:08 - 00:27:42:11
James
But yes, absolutely, this can be a balanced base. This can be a topper. This can be a really convenient and mobile training treat. So it really fits all of those different.

00:27:42:12 - 00:27:47:06
Kristen
Right. And does it look and feel like a kibble doesn't have the same kind of does?

00:27:47:06 - 00:28:02:22
James
The one obviously standout feature is that it's very light. that's always the the challenge maybe for that first pet parent that goes to pull a bag off the store shelf, you know, it looks like a big 18 pound bag of kibble, but you pull it off and it feels like nothing. It feels like 8 or 9 pounds of of product.

00:28:02:22 - 00:28:23:20
James
So it can be a little bit of a shock in that sense. So it's important for us to also build that education side of things, to really educate those pet parents that, yes, this feels like it's 9 pounds, but it feeds like that 18 or 18 plus pound bag. Right? So the kibble size is very, familiar I guess, to those kibble parents.

00:28:23:20 - 00:28:41:11
James
But it's also got those little visible pieces of whole food right solutions that speaks to them from a health and nutrition side of things. But right with that kind of light property that free strike does as well. So delivering all of that like light doesn't mean less. That's been our motto ever since. And it's something we're really trying to drive home with the education.

00:28:41:11 - 00:28:46:22
Kristen
Gotcha. Okay. And from what I understand, kibble in the raw is available now in neighborhood stores across the country.

00:28:46:22 - 00:29:05:22
James
Absolutely. It's been available, I believe, since about, about early June or early January of this year. And we're really starting to pump up some of our marketing campaign on that as well. So you'll not only be able to see kibble on the right in more, neighborhood pet stores moving forward, but you'll also probably see some things coming at you on some of your social media platforms and such to really.

00:29:05:22 - 00:29:14:05
James
Yes, you know, us trying to to promote this amazing product and get some, some more consumers and pepperonis out there introducing a little bit of raw, fresh nutrition.

00:29:14:05 - 00:29:19:11
Kristen
Right. Hey, and I just thought another question, where where would they find it in the stores are going to be with the other.

00:29:19:12 - 00:29:34:19
James
This is this is the key is it's going to be on your kibble store really in that kibble aisle. And it's a way to again, yeah, draw the attention from that kibble consumer and really start building and starting that conversation to get them moving from a little bit of Campbell to a little bit of kibble on the raw.

00:29:34:19 - 00:29:53:18
James
And maybe that is what they need to kind of platform them into, maybe moving to some other freeze dried or even frozen raw. Right? So anything that can kind of get that cascade starting and get them thinking about how they can introduce these products in at a, at a cost point, again, that's a little bit more, ideal, for them to, to manage and deal with.

00:29:53:18 - 00:29:57:21
James
It's it's always our goal. Just any raw is better than is better than.

00:29:57:23 - 00:30:14:18
Kristen
Right. Fantastic. Well, I'm so glad that you all are, are bringing such great innovation to allow more pet parents and more pets to benefit from raw food and to live their best, healthiest, happiest lives. You guys are awesome and thanks for being with me, Doctor Jones. And, have a great rest of this out.

00:30:14:18 - 00:30:21:07
James
Well, thank you so much for having me. This is, delightful. Last few minutes. and, yeah, I look forward to what happens next.

00:30:21:07 - 00:30:23:13
Kristen
I'll give us the website. Is it primal?

00:30:23:13 - 00:30:34:04
James
Primal pet food? Primal pet food.com. Okay. Absolutely. Check it out. We got lots of, cool information and good educational information on there about these products. If you want to learn more, that's definitely the place to check it out.

00:30:34:05 - 00:30:36:00
Kristen
Excellent. Thanks, doctor James. Of course.

00:30:36:00 - 00:30:39:03
James
Thank you so much.

00:30:39:05 - 00:30:55:10
Chris
You know, Kristen, it's just another person who's way smarter than us on the podcast, you know? Right. I don't know what the producers are doing bringing in all these people who make us look so, so, so foolish and stupid. but what what incredible person. Right. and the work that Doctor Templeton's doing.

00:30:55:12 - 00:31:17:22
Kristen
Yeah, absolutely. and he, he was starstruck himself by meeting Doctor Courtney Campbell, who, we also interviewed on the podcast. It was funny because his wife is, is going to be a board certified surgeon. And doctor Campbell is a board certified veterinary surgeon. So that was kind of kind of cute to see him. you know, just be so excited to meet a celebrity in his mind.

00:31:18:00 - 00:31:31:06
Chris
Yes. There we go. Well, yeah. Yeah, I guess that it differs for everybody who the celebrities are. For me, it's Magnus, the therapy dog. Right? That's what's. That's where I sit on. On what really makes up a celebrity.

00:31:31:12 - 00:31:33:12
Kristen
All right, I think it's product time.

00:31:33:14 - 00:31:41:13
Chris
The product of the week. It's product time per pop up product, of the week.

00:31:41:15 - 00:31:42:11
Kristen
You want to go first?

00:31:42:15 - 00:32:03:16
Chris
I love this section. Yeah, I'll go first. I'll go first. I got a fun one. So this is a product, that I, you know, I've known about for a while. And, working with Global Pet Expo, it's one of those products that I've really seen grown and become popular. and there are a lot of brands doing this, but I want to really focus on, Yeti dog chew.

00:32:03:18 - 00:32:28:08
Chris
So what they make is they call them yak puff and play like, treat toys. It's essentially a pasteurized cheese that they make in the Himalayan mountains. And now I know what you're thinking. It's like we're not supposed to give the dog cheese, but this is a very special kind of cheese. And the gimmick, and I'm calling it a gimmick because I just don't have a better word.

00:32:28:10 - 00:32:29:05
Kristen
Let's call it the hook.

00:32:29:05 - 00:33:02:16
Chris
The snake is. Yeah, the hook is you put this, this treat in the microwave for, like, 30s, and it puffs up, and it becomes sort of crispy. It's like a really good texture for the dog's teeth. it becomes more difficult to eat, but not in that bad way. More of like that stimuli eating way. And now they have this line of toys where what you do is you, you know, you have your rubber toy and you put the treat in and then you microwave it and it puffs and expands out inside the toy.

00:33:02:18 - 00:33:20:08
Chris
and it sort of becomes like a time engagement stimulation thing that you can put in front of your dog. It's going to give them, you know, especially if you have a ravenous dog, right, who you put a treat in front of and it disappears. This will give them some more time with it, some more stimulation, it becomes engaging.

00:33:20:08 - 00:33:40:02
Chris
They kind of have to dig around and figure it out. the rubber toys are really hearty. so really great for those really heavy chewers. Same with the puff. Really great. Good for gum health. it's good for for their teeth. and according to Yeti, and there's a bunch of brands who do a, a similar product.

00:33:40:04 - 00:33:53:00
Chris
there's really. No, I wouldn't call this a a healthy treat. You know, we've gone over a lot of those organic, super healthy supplemental treats. I don't think it's it's it's that but it's it's engaging. It's fun. And dogs. Yeah. Absolutely.

00:33:53:00 - 00:34:09:17
Kristen
Go wild for it I love this and I actually I pulled this up so I'm as soon as we're done recording the pod today I'm buying this for tulip I love it. And actually it kind of is healthy if you think of it from an enrichment standpoint. So, you know, because, you know, if the dog has to kind of work at it to get to the treat out.

00:34:09:17 - 00:34:17:12
Kristen
They're using their brain. They're using their, you know, it's a physical and mental exercise. And of course, they're getting to enjoy the treat. That's really cool.

00:34:17:14 - 00:34:40:09
Chris
According to their website, their cheese is nutrient packed food that contains protein, calcium, vitamin B12. And so rhenium. like I said, I'm not a scientist. I have no idea if I'm pronouncing that correctly. I don't know what selenium is. and it while they admit it is high in calorie, it is meant to be consumed as a treat.

00:34:40:09 - 00:34:43:00
Chris
So, that shouldn't be impactful.

00:34:43:00 - 00:34:44:10
Kristen
So in moderation, right?

00:34:44:12 - 00:34:49:13
Chris
I believe the website I have here is just Yeti pet. Yeti pet. Check it out.

00:34:49:14 - 00:35:12:03
Kristen
Ask easy enough to remember. Okay, so my product, when I, when I first discovered this, actually I discovered it on Instagram, I think. And the first thing I thought about was, this is a great product for a cat, but it's also for for bird lovers. So it's called the, what's it called? It's called the bird buddy.

00:35:12:05 - 00:35:14:06
Kristen
Have you ever seen this?

00:35:14:08 - 00:35:15:00
Chris
I don't think.

00:35:15:00 - 00:35:41:04
Kristen
It is so cool. So what it is, is a little bird feeder that you that you mount outdoors. And this is to attract wild birds. And it uses it has a little camera in it and it uses AI. So when the bird lands on the little perch and is and is eating the the bird seed, the camera is capturing its its image in video and uses AI to tell you what kind of wild bird that is.

00:35:41:06 - 00:36:03:21
Kristen
So, you know, it's like I said, I originally thought this is a great enrichment product for a cat. You know, it's when we're recording, this is springtime. So there's, you know, the birds are out and and for indoor cats, it's important that we make sure that they have enough enrichment and stimulation indoors. and one way to do that is to, you know, hang a bird feeder outside for them to watch.

00:36:03:23 - 00:36:25:22
Kristen
But the more I, the more I like dove into this product. I thought, this thing is so cool. There's even, there's even a link on their website at Bird Buddy. It's called My Bird buddy.com where you can go and you can you can see videos that people all over the country and maybe all over the world have uploaded, so that you can see the different birds in the different regions of the country.

00:36:25:22 - 00:36:32:01
Kristen
So if you're a bird lover and you have a cat, this would be a great gift for both of you.

00:36:32:03 - 00:36:55:16
Chris
Yeah, or if you're just a bird lover, I mean, birds are an enormous commitment, to to own a bird as a pet is an enormous commitment. It is not. You know, I think a lot of people think dog is like, you know, the, the most responsibility followed by cat. And while that's largely true, you can't undersell how difficult it could be to keep birds.

00:36:55:16 - 00:37:09:08
Chris
So if you're somebody who enjoys the presence of of birds but doesn't want the response ability of, of, you know, taking care of them, this could be a great way for you to, engage with your wild side.

00:37:09:10 - 00:37:13:03
Kristen
Absolutely. So my bird bodycon.

00:37:13:05 - 00:37:39:07
Chris
My my bird buddy.com. Check it out. Q and A's. And now, Kristen, I believe it is time for my personal favorite segment on the show, which is questions from, from from the audience. And again, I'm going to preface this by saying, you know, we're we're not veterinarians. We're we're just two we're just two pet people who love pets.

00:37:39:07 - 00:37:58:02
Chris
We're going to try our best to answer these, these questions, to the best of our ability. I haven't seen them. So this is going to be completely off, off the dome in terms of, the advice that that I end up delivering. But we'll we'll see how I do this time. Any vets listening to me? please, please don't be mean.

00:37:58:02 - 00:38:01:06
Chris
I'm trying my best. You're harder than me.

00:38:01:08 - 00:38:20:11
Kristen
Well, Chris, I think you might actually do okay on this first one. so. Okay. Gosh, I you know what? I've got to find the name of this person. I just have Memphis, Tennessee. the question is, I've noticed my cat scratching her ears a lot more than usual, and she seems a bit irritated. What might be causing this?

00:38:20:11 - 00:38:27:18
Kristen
And when should I consider taking her to the vet? I thought maybe you would experience this with your kitty.

00:38:27:20 - 00:38:42:15
Chris
Yeah. That's a that's a great question. first of all, my first piece of advice, it's one of those things where if you start asking yourself, should I take the cat to the vet? The answer's almost always yes. Yes, right. I agree, like, if that's something that's in your mind, that's cooking of like, should I be taking this animal to the vet?

00:38:42:15 - 00:39:13:23
Chris
The answer is almost always yes. cats are prone to ear infections and all sorts of weird things that go on with their ears. There's a zillion products out there, that are either traps or, or or like some type of, ointment and things like that. To help with that. I would say my best guess, if a cat is scratching their ears a lot, even especially to the point where they're creating scabs, you know, you'll see that with animals a lot because they don't have fine motor skills.

00:39:13:23 - 00:39:32:21
Chris
They don't have the control for that gentle itch either all or nothing. So if it's to the point where it's scabbing up, I would say probably an infection is probably number one, which is, easily fixable with modern medicine. So yes, that and then option two through ten are all things that are going to need a vet as well.

00:39:32:23 - 00:39:42:14
Chris
So if the problem's not going away, it's time to take the cat to a vet. They probably need antibiotics or some type of other product which your vet would be best to recommend.

00:39:42:16 - 00:39:49:21
Kristen
I think that's great advice. And by the way, that was from Nina Nina in Memphis, Tennessee. So thank you, Nina for that question, Nina.

00:39:49:23 - 00:39:52:12
Chris
And thanks for listening from Memphis, Tennessee.

00:39:52:14 - 00:40:10:07
Kristen
Yeah, this is from Raj from Sacramento. Okay. And Raja's question is I now, this one's going to be tough for us. Well, I sticky for myself but I he says I notice my my beta fish. Do you say beta or beta? I say beta beta theta fish.

00:40:10:09 - 00:40:17:12
Chris
But I think it's better. But okay. You know, correct us in the comments, people just go ahead and rip us apart.

00:40:17:13 - 00:40:41:06
Kristen
Okay? My beta fish has has been less active than usual and spends a lot of time near the bottom of the tank. Is this normal behavior or should I be concerned about his health? Well, first off, I am absolutely no fish expert. However, and again, getting back to what you said earlier, Chris, any time, your pet of any type is having some type of unusual behavior acting differently.

00:40:41:11 - 00:41:08:14
Kristen
So anything that concerns you, I think you need to talk to a veterinarian. And believe it or not, there are veterinarians that specialize in aquatics. Now, I don't know how prevalent they are or how you might, find one, but, for this one, I'd probably. You know what? I'd go to the store. A store that sells aquatic, you know, fish and that sort of thing, and ask them.

00:41:08:16 - 00:41:31:09
Chris
I would agree with that. I would say that I don't think this immediately calls the attention of a vet. So I had a beta betta fish, as a kid. and when I noticed that it was in poor health, its color changed. That was like a big indication that it was in poor health. which could be for a variety of reasons.

00:41:31:09 - 00:41:51:15
Chris
As, as a kid, it was mostly because I didn't clean its tank properly. so if the if the fish looks the same, and especially that beautiful tail it has, if it's still full, its health is fine. When a betta fish becomes inactive, it's usually because they're tired of swimming around and they're literally looking for a nice place to rest.

00:41:51:21 - 00:42:14:03
Chris
So two things I would recommend may need a bigger tank, a B may need a tank with more features, and places for it to hide and get away. because what you would, what you wouldn't notice if it had these features, you wouldn't notice the fish resting, it would hide in its little and its little cove, and that's where it would rest.

00:42:14:08 - 00:42:34:05
Chris
So you may just need a bigger tank with some more stuff in it. But I think a great first step, as Kristin said, is go to a local aquatic hobby or pet shop and ask somebody who has seen this a million times before, but that that would be my best guess. And I am, you know, I haven't kept fish since I was a, a child.

00:42:34:05 - 00:42:38:15
Chris
And I have a funny story. Maybe I'll use one day on the podcast.

00:42:38:17 - 00:42:41:11
Kristen
You sound like you know what you're talking about. Which is.

00:42:41:16 - 00:42:42:11
Chris
That's,

00:42:42:12 - 00:42:43:12
Kristen
Kind of scary.

00:42:43:14 - 00:43:00:14
Chris
And that is a skill of mine. I kind of always sound like I know what I'm talking about. but that does not mean I always do know what I talk about. So that's the big, caveat to all of the advice I give on this podcast is you should seek the help of somebody who is a professional, right?

00:43:00:14 - 00:43:13:06
Chris
If I, if I, if I spur you and urge you to do that, then I've done my job. But, you know, we're here to help. In the meantime, we'll say while you're driving to work today, we'll get we'll give you something to chew on. So there you.

00:43:13:06 - 00:43:13:19
Kristen
Go. Who is.

00:43:13:19 - 00:43:16:12
Chris
That? Who or who are we thinking for that question? Was that right?

00:43:16:12 - 00:43:18:23
Kristen
Oh, rush. Yes. Rodger in Sacramento.

00:43:18:23 - 00:43:22:06
Chris
Thank you for the question, Raj. And thank you for listening to the podcast.

00:43:22:08 - 00:43:45:09
Kristen
Hey. And remember, you can submit your own question if you go to dog TV.com slash pal podcast, just scroll down to the bottom where the form is. You can either enter the question via, you know, just type it in or we would love it if you would submit a voice, a question in your own voice. So there's a button button there where you can record your question, and then we will play it on the pod.

00:43:45:11 - 00:44:05:01
Chris
Absolutely. Yeah. Be sure to go in and leave your feedback as well. if you feel like we're doing something totally wrong, if you have any suggestions for the show or segments you'd like to see, feel free to leave those in the in the question box as well, too. You know, this is why we're here to serve you all.

00:44:05:03 - 00:44:14:12
Chris
and we're open to feedback. So, be sure to get those questions in, record your voice memos, and, you'll be hearing from us, that's for sure.

00:44:14:13 - 00:44:16:18
Kristen
I think that's a wrap, Chris.

00:44:16:20 - 00:44:19:20
Chris
That's a wrap. That's the end of our show. That's it.

00:44:19:22 - 00:44:22:14
Kristen
I know you want to keep talking. That's it. That's all done today.

00:44:22:14 - 00:44:45:22
Chris
Okay, well, listen, thank you, everybody, for listening to the show. If you have enjoyed this episode of the Pets and Life podcast, please be sure to, like, subscribe. whatever else you do on your podcast apps, everybody's got a different word for it. Whether whether it's follow, that's a follow, smash hit. It's hit the button so hard that it does it twice.

00:44:46:00 - 00:45:04:08
Chris
unsubscribe and then resubscribe. Leave us a five star review if you think what we're doing is great. If you don't think what we're doing is great, leave us a five star review anyway, and tell us in the comments what we can do to make the show better. as always, I have been Chris Spotify. I'm joined, as always by the lovely Kristen Levine.

00:45:04:13 - 00:45:09:06
Chris
This has been the Pets at Life podcast. Thank you for listening and we'll see you next week.