129. Pet Nutrition, Cooperative Care & Building Healthier Habits for Pets

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Speaker 1 (00:00):

Pets Ad Life, your guide to the latest in pet trends, products, and the joy of the human animal bond with Kristen Levine and me, Chris Bonafati, powered by the American Pet Products Association and dog TV. Hello and welcome to another episode of Pets Ad Life. I am one of your co-hosts, Chris Bonafotti, and joining me as always traveling deep within the jungles of Chile is Kristen Levine. Kristen, you're playing an away game today.

 

Speaker 2 (00:32):

I am. I am. And I specifically rented this Airbnb just so I could do the show with a video screen just like yours, because you stepped up your set game last week. I did.

 

Speaker 1 (00:43):

I'm a trendsetter. I'm a trendsetter. I'm really at the forefront of this whole podcasting thing. They're calling me the Steve Jobs of podcasting. Yeah. So listen, that's not me saying that. It's them. Okay. It's them. They're saying that. But hey, we've got a new set over there, an away game set for Kristen, a new set here for Chris, but we're still bringing you the same stuff. We're going to do two stories, two guests. We're going to answer two of your questions. We're going to do two products, the same old pal twosome as always. That's

 

Speaker 2 (01:21):

Right.

 

Speaker 1 (01:22):

For these adult days of summer.

 

Speaker 2 (01:25):

I got to wish my sister happy birthday. We were releasing this show on July 21st. It's her birthday. Yeah. It's not a special number birthday, but yeah, she's younger. She always likes to point that out to me. How much younger she is than me.

 

Speaker 1 (01:43):

Well, she couldn't be what? If you're 35, she's probably what, like 32, 33? Yeah, 32.

 

Speaker 2 (01:49):

It's her 32nd birthday ready.

 

Speaker 1 (01:51):

Happy 32nd birthday to Kristen's sister. Kristen and Chris present story time. All right. And kicking it off with story time. Kristen, do you want me to put you on the spot? Sure.

 

Speaker 2 (02:07):

Sure.

 

Speaker 1 (02:08):

I'll go

 

Speaker 2 (02:08):

First. Yeah. I found an interesting story. This is a potential tax credit coming to New Jersey Pet Parents. Yeah. So a New Jersey assembly bill, the bill number is 4995, was introduced by Assemblyman Alex. Oh, I don't know how to pronounce this. Anyway, it would give pet owners up to $900 in state income tax credits. That's $300 for just general costs like food and supplies and up to $600 for vet bills. Yeah. Yeah. And apparently New York is weighing a very similar bill. So hopefully the bill will get voted. It's not scheduled for a vote yet, but that's got to be coming up soon. But I thought that was really exciting news because if this gets passed in Jersey and then New York, then hopefully before you know it, other states will have this tax credit. And this is, just to clarify, it's an actual dollar for dollar tax cut.

 

(03:12):

It's not like a deduction. So yeah, 900 bucks. We could all use 900 bucks in our pocket.

 

Speaker 1 (03:18):

Sounds like a write off. And I love a write off. Yeah.

 

Speaker 2 (03:20):

Who doesn't love a good write off?

 

Speaker 1 (03:22):

Who doesn't love a write off, right? You just write it off. You get to write off your pet. How about that?

 

Speaker 2 (03:27):

Exactly. All right. What's your story?

 

Speaker 1 (03:30):

I want to talk about ticks. It's been a terrible tick summer so far. I was playing golf the other day and found a tick on me before it managed to bite. But this wasn't even tall grasses. This was like a well maintained golf course. And that's how I know it's really bad. So I just wanted everyone to know that your pet is never 100% safe. Even if you're using flea and tick medication or the collars or something, they're like 99% effective. And in a year where there's so much tick volume, if you've got one of those outdoor dogs who's really going to head into the woods and have a bit of an adventure or if you're hiking often and things like that, you should still be doing tick checks. So the CDC

 

(04:26):

Recommends doing tick checks on your pets, especially cats. And between their toes is where they're saying is like the spot that gets missed the most. So if you have an outdoor cat and they've been in the woods, you're going to pick them up and you're going to press your little thumb into the center of their paw. It's going to relax their muscles and painlessly expend their claws and loosen up their little toe beans and just take a little peak in there. You don't have to get your hands in, just take a little peak and check for those ticks. So that's just a PSA style story from Chris today.

 

Speaker 2 (05:05):

And I have a related story, kind of a gross story. Well, first of all, you were talking about checking your cats and dogs. It's so tough to see ticks on a black or a dark colored dog or cat. So true. They've really, really, really got to be vigilant. But listen to this. I'm out of town for a week. I've been in Florida. And Paul called me the other day and he said he was taking tulip for a walk. And she started shaking her paw. And he looks down and there was a tick. And as he's going to grab the tick, she put her head down and she ate it.

 

Speaker 1 (05:37):

Hey. Apex predator.

 

Speaker 2 (05:39):

Right?

 

Speaker 1 (05:40):

Apex predator. Well, that's why I always. There's been a big resurgence up here in the Northeast in bringing the bat population back because they had found their way into everybody's attic when I was growing up in the '90s and through the new millennia and to the 2010s, they called all the bats. And now the mosquitoes and ticks are the worst they've ever been. And what do bats mostly eat? Mosquitoes. It's like mosquitoes, flies and ticks. Bring

 

Speaker 2 (06:07):

Back the bats.

 

Speaker 1 (06:08):

Bring back the bats. Yes. That is just another Batman bias of mine. Beyond the leash, exploring the untold stories of pet passion and professionalism. Joining us now is Dr. Megan Sprinkle, a board certified veterinary nutritionist, speaker, consultant, writer, and educator dedicated to advancing pet health through science-based nutrition. Throughout her career, she has worked across clinical practice, academia, industry, and consulting, helping veterinarians and pet owners better understand the critical role nutrition plays in long-term health and wellness. Currently serving as head of veterinary affairs at Golden Child, a fresh dog food company focused on proactive nutrition and strengthening the human animal bond. Dr. Sprinkle is passionate about making veterinary nutrition more accessible and actionable for pet families. In addition to her work, she advises emerging pet health companies, speaks nationally on veterinary topics, and is known for her innovative forward-thinking approach to improving pet care through education, technology and collaboration.

 

(07:09):

Dr. Sprinkle, thank you so much for taking some time out of your day.

 

Speaker 3 (07:13):

Thank you. That was an amazing introduction.

 

Speaker 1 (07:15):

I'd love to say I wrote it myself, but I just yell the words into the microphone. But wow, what an impressive resume. Pet owners receive nutrition advice from veterinarians, from social media, from pet stores, from breeders, from their strange uncles. From us. Yeah. From us who might also be their strange uncle. Why has pet nutrition become so confusing? Why is there so much conflicting information? And where should pet owners go to get the most trustworthy stuff?

 

Speaker 3 (07:49):

Yeah. I think we are in the age of overinformation and you can pretty much find a different answer just depending on where you look. And so I think that's inside and outside of pet nutrition. But I think one of the reasons why it's really confusing is that ultimately, while yes, it's interesting on what all dogs need and all cats need, what's really important is what your dog needs and what your cat needs. And so a lot of the information out there can be very general. And so ultimately it's best to figure out what are the unique needs that your cat and dog have that are going to be helpful in finding the right diet for your pet. And that really comes down to between you and your veterinary team, they know your pet the best and they're really going to help set you up with knowing some specific things to look for regarding on choosing a diet.

 

(08:46):

And that could be knowing your pet's body condition score. So you know maybe what's a good calorie target to look for specific health needs like joint support, those kinds of things. So I think that really helps is kind of eliminating some of that noise and honing in on what does my pet specifically need? And I think that's a much better starting place.

 

Speaker 2 (09:08):

Yeah. You mentioned obesity, Dr. Sprinkle. It's one of the biggest health issues facing pets today. It's so common. Why is the excess weight such a concern? And what are some signs that owners might not realize that their pet is overweight?

 

Speaker 3 (09:26):

Yeah. Great questions. So let me get a little nerdy just for a second. Please. But I think it helps.

 

Speaker 1 (09:33):

Permission granted.

 

Speaker 3 (09:35):

Awesome. I think it helps understand when you look at that excess fat on the body, it's not benign just sitting there doing nothing. It's actually a state of inflammation. So it makes sense that obesity is so linked to all these other health concerns and risks. So obesity increases your risk for joint disease is one really obvious one, but we also see connections between increased risk in cancer, in heart disease and other issues. And so it's really important that it's not just cute, which it might be for some dogs, but it really is a health concern that we need to think about in a long term scenario. Your second question about what might be something that a pet parent might miss. Kind of going back to your first point is there are, according to statistics, more overweight pets than ideal weight pets. So our perception of what is, maybe it shouldn't be normal, right?

 

(10:40):

Of what is appropriate is a little off. So that may be one thing to acknowledge is that on all the more to talk with your veterinary team to make sure that your particular pet is on track. The other thing, I will admit, a lot of our pets are very fluffy. And so like on a day-to-day basis, you may not obviously see a drastic increase in weight until maybe you're kind of far along. And one additional pound on a miniature poodle is a little bit different than if we put on one pound. So it can happen pretty quickly. So again, making sure that you're talking with your veterinary team, proactively bring it up. I love my colleagues, but don't wait for them to bring it up. Just go ahead and proactively ask about it and work with them to make sure that you're on the right track with your pet.

 

Speaker 1 (11:33):

Yeah. Let's talk about diets with dogs and cats. And you mentioned a stat that I also love to bring up that there's more obese cats and dogs in the United States than ideal weight cats and dogs. And I think a lot of pet parents have tried to get that weight down on their pet and they end up failing. So talk to us a little bit about how to create a sustainable dieting plan for our dog or cat and get them down to that ideal weight.

 

Speaker 3 (12:06):

Yeah. Well, ultimately, if you are having trouble, sorry to sound like a broken record, make sure you are talking to your vet. Yes. And a lot of times, because again, that very constant measuring, don't do it like, okay, we're going to go on a diet and then I'll check in with my vet in a year. That's way too long to wait to check in and make sure you're on the right track. A lot of the ones, especially that have trouble losing weight, really do need a very special diet that's specifically designed for weight loss. So it's worth the investment. You're going to get to where you want to be safer as well as at appropriate time. So just like looking at the diet from that perspective, do you need to try another diet? Doesn't mean necessarily that they have to be on that diet for life.

 

(12:57):

But in the meantime, to get to that ideal weight, it's probably that might be the best option for your pet. And then I will call out sometimes these are the sneaky things that come up are like the additional treats. And if you're sharing your popcorn on movie night and all those sneaky little calories that sneak in there, we need to make sure that we're keeping account of those special things as well.

 

Speaker 2 (13:23):

Yes. Well, I'm going to make sure my husband hears this episode because -

 

Speaker 1 (13:27):

He's guilty.

 

Speaker 2 (13:29):

We have this issue in our house and I was actually going to ask you about this. I know that we use treats as a way to bond with our pets. And my husband's love language is food. So how can I delicately help him help her by factoring in the treats that he loves to give her without it being ultimately being too many calories in a day?

 

Speaker 3 (13:57):

Yes. I completely understand. I have a dog myself and watching my dog get excited about something that I give her is, it does impact you.You feel so good. And so sometimes that is, if you can associate that with meal time too, is that if they get excited about the meal, then we don't feel like we have to overly treat maybe. But I do believe in making sure that as veterinarians, we call it the treat allowance. I think it is good to vocalize that that is important. It is part of bonding and that's great. But just make sure that you know how much you are feeding in that. So I know this doesn't sound like a lot of fun, but if you're like, "Man, popcorn time with my dog is really important to me," then let's look at, okay, how many calories is in a cup of popcorn?

 

(14:51):

And does that work with your dog? Is that within about the 10% that we kind of give as the treat allowance? And you can know that that's okay. And we just minimize all those other things. So what's the priority? Start there. Know how many calories that is for your pet. And then just make it part of the feeding tradition. So it does not have to be boring. You don't have to give away everything. Just be a little bit more mindful about what it all actually means for your pet.

 

Speaker 1 (15:23):

That's great advice. I want to pivot a little bit to supplements because they're incredibly popular. There's so many different products on the market making all sorts of different kinds of claims. Do you have supplements that you consider like there's a lot of science backing this particular type? And what should pet owners be aware of before deciding to add supplements to their pet's diet?

 

Speaker 3 (15:50):

Yeah. One disclaimer, there's pros and cons to this, but the pet supplement industry has a lot less regulation. So it's just something to be mindful of when you are going to select something for your pet. I said that there's pros and cons. I'll say a pro because this comes up as someone who is in the innovation space in the pet industry, that there are some really great nutritional, beneficial ingredients out there that AFCO doesn't have approved for complete and balanced foods. And so as much as I want to put these wonderful data backed kind of things in the food, I can't legally because AFCO hasn't gone through the process to make them approve for food. So again, there are pros and cons to having this supplement route to getting some of these nutrition needs to your pet. I'll give you two examples. One might be really boring and I'm sorry, but I do love them and they are really boring.

 

Speaker 1 (16:56):

Org is good.

 

Speaker 3 (16:58):

And that's omega-3 fatty acids. Very specifically coming from marine sources because that we know is bringing in the EPA and DHA that has all those wonderful anti-inflammatory and all the good benefits there. So that as a nutritionist has been tried and true, one of my favorites, heavily researched backed. You talked about washouts. It still is a source of dietary fat. And so it is still good to work with your veterinarian to make sure you're accounting for what might be coming through the food to get the right amount for your pet and their specific needs. So that's my boring one. One of the newer ones that is gaining a lot, a lot of data, and it's just super exciting because it also overcomes some of the challenges with probiotics are postbiotics. So this one might be a newer one for a lot of people, but if you start to look, they're coming up more and more actually both in human nutrition and pet nutrition.

 

(18:07):

And some of the benefits are like all that you think about with encouraging a healthy microbiome population. This helps getting all those benefits. But unlike probiotics, which are actual live organisms, postbiotics are not alive. So I don't have to worry about keeping them alive throughout the process and making sure that actually gets to the GI tract to do all the wonderful things we want it to do. So these postbiotics kind of overcome a lot of the challenges with, again, all the really cool benefits that we like about supporting a really healthy microbiome. So that's hopefully a newer interested one.

 

Speaker 1 (18:47):

That's new. That the first time I heard postbiotics. And in my head I'm like, there's a post Malone joke in there somewhere. You'll get there eventually, Chris.

 

Speaker 2 (18:57):

And actually we're coming up on time already, Dr. Sprinkle. So can you give us one closing bit of advice for every pet parent regarding nutrition and then tell us where we can follow your work as a nutritionist?

 

Speaker 3 (19:11):

Yeah. Oh goodness. As you could probably tell, I could give a lot of thoughts and advice, but you know what? You' already

 

Speaker 2 (19:17):

Dropped some great value bombs.

 

Speaker 3 (19:20):

Thank you. I think we all want our pets to live as long as possible and that every day that they do live is really healthy and happy. And so really, again, back to data back to the best thing that I can offer for that is keeping your pet at a good body condition score. So it really is important to talk with your veterinary team about keeping your pets at a healthy weight. And so ultimately, if that's what you're looking for, that's the best piece of advice I have.

 

Speaker 2 (19:48):

Excellent. Excellent. And can we follow you on social or is there

 

Speaker 3 (19:53):

A

 

Speaker 2 (19:53):

Website you'd like us to check out?

 

Speaker 3 (19:55):

Sure. You can find me on most platforms. I tend to hang out on LinkedIn the most, but you can also look up My Golden Child too and follow us to see all the fun things that we're doing there.

 

Speaker 1 (20:06):

Awesome. Well, thank you so much for taking some time out of your day and giving us this awesome information. I've learned quite a few tidbits. I'm sure our listeners are getting their money's worth on this podcast they listen to for free. Yes. But thank you so much for joining us today. Thank

 

Speaker 3 (20:27):

You very much for having me.

 

Speaker 1 (20:31):

Dr. Sprinkle was awesome. I feel like I learned so much, which is as we gain episodes here, it becomes more and more difficult for me to gain new information. But I learned like three or four new things from those 15 minutes, which was really awesome.

 

Speaker 2 (20:48):

Your takeaway was about postbiotics, right?

 

Speaker 1 (20:50):

Postbiotics. Yeah. I'd never heard that I knew about the antibiotics and about the probiotics. And that seems like it's a set duality. You know what I mean? That there can only be two. Now there's postbiotics and I'm looking forward to seeing what the industry does with that kind of new information.

 

Speaker 2 (21:10):

I'm delighted to introduce our guest today, Dr. Deb Jones. She's a dog trainer, an author, an educator, and a psychologist who's spent more than 30 years studying learning, behavior and the relationship between people and their dogs. With an academic background in behavioral and social psychology, Deb has become one of the respected voices in positive reinforcement training and cooperative care, helping dog owners better understand how animals learn and how to reduce fear and stress in everyday handling situations. Over the course of Dr. Deb's career, she is trained and competed with a variety of breeds in obedience, agility, rally, and other dog sports while also teaching thousands of students around the world. She is the author of numerous books, including Cooperative Care: Seven Steps to Stress-Free Husbandry: A Groundbreaking Guide that helps pet parents teach dogs to willingly participate in things like grooming, nail trims, vet exams, and other routine procedures.

 

(22:11):

I'm so excited to talk to you today, Dr. Deb.

 

Speaker 4 (22:14):

Oh, thank you so much. I really appreciate you asking me to be here. I am always happy to talk about dog stuff. Obviously all happy to talk about dog stuff. It makes it sound like I've done a lot and now I feel kind of tired actually.

 

Speaker 1 (22:29):

We get that a lot actually.

 

Speaker 2 (22:31):

You have been busy, but you're going to help -

 

Speaker 4 (22:33):

It's been a lot of years.

 

Speaker 2 (22:36):

Now you're going to educate us and our audience today. You have such a unique background, both as a psychologist and a dog trainer. So how has your understanding of human behavior influenced the way you approach dog training?

 

Speaker 4 (22:50):

I think that's what got me into dog training was just the study of behavior in general. I was really fascinated back when I was in college, the whole idea of behavior being predictable and that we really could have a very big influence on behavior. And actually what I've discovered over the years is it's a lot easier to change the behavior of animals than it is to change the behavior of people. I believe that. People are hard. People are difficult. Animals are straightforward and fairly simple. Once you figure out what they want, you've got it. It's pretty easy. But with people, there's a lot of complications involved. Well,

 

Speaker 1 (23:33):

If you figure out how to change people's behavior, I think you're really beyond to something. Yes. I think a lot of pet owners think that dog training is about teaching commands, but I think it's way beyond that. What do you think people misunderstand most about how our dogs learn?

 

Speaker 4 (23:51):

I think that, and this was true of me as well in the beginning, the whole idea of training is to get them to do what I want. That's the whole goal without thinking about what they want or what they need. Just if I can get them to do the things I want, they'll fit into my life fine and everything will be okay. And happily I've seen change over the years. Now we are becoming much more concerned with the dogs getting their needs met and with it being more of a cooperative relationship rather than I tell you what to do when you do it. Very one-way street, which is unfortunately some people still follow that paradigm. But for a lot of us, the idea is I want it to be more of a working partnership and I want whatever animal I'm working with to be happy to work with me, to want to work with me, to be comfortable with what I'm asking them to do.

 

(24:45):

And that all kind of evolved into this idea of cooperative care rather than pressure or force to get them to comply with what I wanted. It's that I can work on getting you to cooperate with what I want you to do.

 

Speaker 2 (24:59):

Well, and you are widely known for your work in cooperative care, which is a new term for a lot of pet parents, I would think. So what exactly is cooperative care? Why has it become such an important concept in modern dog training and modern life

 

Speaker 4 (25:15):

Dogs? It's becoming a thing. It's becoming a big thing. And it all started because I had a dog who hated going to the vet. For years, my dogs went to the vet, they didn't love it, but they didn't hate it. And we just did what we had to do. It wasn't pleasant, but it wasn't horrible. And then I had one dog who decided, no, absolutely not. I am not letting them touch me. And she was very, very clear border colleague. Star was her name. And she was very clear that she was not going to be examined and they were not going to do things to her. And I could tell it came out of fear that she was uncomfortable. She was afraid. She felt pressured. Strangers are coming at her with strange objects and she's not having it. There's just no way. Most of my other dogs would be like, "Okay, whatever." And a lot of dogs are fine with it.

 

(26:03):

But when they're not, they're really not. And I knew that I had to find ways to make her comfortable because she had hopefully 14 or 15 years of veterinary care in her life. And so I started working, going back to the things that I knew from learning theories, especially learning how to be comfortable and learning to relax and learning to trust that things were going to turn out okay. And so that trust is hard to build and it's easy to lose.

 

Speaker 1 (26:38):

I think that's a great point. And I think in the introduction, Kristen listed things like nail trimming and grooming. And you're touching on the vet visits. And I think all the pet parents at home, they want to know the secret to building that trust because those are the pain points in their lives and their relationship with their dog. So what are some things that pet parents can do now to start building that trust to make these important health related things easier on the dog? Yes,

 

Speaker 4 (27:10):

Because these are things that are going to have to happen. Yes. It's not like we have choice in a lot of them, but I start out just getting my dogs used to being touched and handled. And that's different than petting. Everybody thinks my dog likes to be petted and they do, most of them do. But it's a whole different universe when I'm doing something where I have a goal and I'm physically handling you in some way, especially if it might be uncomfortable. So we start with. Oh, there we go. We start with physical handling and then we move. He's like a cat. He's all over the place. We move from there to starting to work on pretending, simulating procedures that are common and likely to be done. And I break things down. I go way back. People say, okay, I need to do my dog's nails.

 

(28:00):

So they grab the dog's foot and they grab the clippers and the dog fights. And then they're in a bad situation that they have just made worse. And so now what are we going to do next? Are we going to use more force, more pressure? That's not what I want to do. Again, I keep thinking for the long term, I don't want to do that for 15 years. I don't want to fight with my dog over what needs to be done. So we go back and we, again, build that trust. When I touch you, it's going to be pleasant. It's not going to be uncomfortable. I'm not going to push you beyond your comfort zone or your limits, but we'll move slowly to more challenging things. So touching the leg and they're comfortable with that. Touching the paw, we're comfortable with that. Picking up the paw, are we comfortable with that?

 

(28:45):

And at every step, I'm using high value reinforcers. My dogs like all kinds of foods, so they make it easy. So I use cheese is like cheese in a can is the thing. Sweet cheese in a can. If I bring that out, I could do surgery on them and they'd be okay.

 

(29:05):

So we do a lot of that work and we do it all before we need it. That's kind of a key for me. Because once you've had the bad experiences, now you're in a hole and you have to work your way out. Well,

 

Speaker 2 (29:16):

Yeah. And that's actually, you're getting to my next question is I understand how that really works well when you're preparing your dog or your cat for a vet visit or a nail trim. But what if you have a dog like my tulip who is already unfortunately terrified of nail trims? Can you reverse that fear and rebuild that trust? You

 

Speaker 4 (29:40):

Can. The great thing about learning is that we can always relearn new things. We can't unlearn. We can't take away what they already know, but we can make a fresh start and we can make it better. And so yeah, I go way back to what I say is baby steps. I go back to what I do in the very beginning. With a puppy. And sometimes it's things like, okay, they don't like the nail tremors. So I start with just showing them the nail tremors and throwing them a cookie. Show the trimmers, throw a cookie. Show the trimmers, throw a cookie. And they're like, bring out the clippers because every time I see them, there's cookies. Yeah. And they are good now. And so I'm trying to do what we call conditioned emotional response, which is making the site of something better and making it a happy thing instead of a scary thing.

 

(30:28):

So sort of like the feeling you have when you go to the dentist, that's not a good emotional response for most of us. And so our dogs have that emotional response to the things that we are trying to do to them, to the tools that we're using. And we want to go back. We want to make it better. And we can do that through, I use a lot of food because my dogs are food motivated. For some dogs, it's play or toys, but it's something they want that we can introduce into our handling sessions and into our training sessions that makes it better for them. So that's where we start when we go back. But I go way back. I always say, go back to the point where the dog is comfortable, not where you think they should be comfortable, but go back to the actual place where your dog is comfortable and start working forward from there.

 

(31:19):

And it's going to be further back than you think. It's not going to be touching the foot. It's going to be maybe just moving your hand towards your dog and working on that for a while first. So always backwards to move forward. Do you think

 

Speaker 1 (31:31):

The environment that they're in has anything to do with it? Should you try and trim your dog's nails in the same place in your home so they get all that positive retention? Do you think that plays into it a bit?

 

Speaker 4 (31:45):

That's an excellent question. Context matters a lot to animals where something happens. And I actually work very hard on making the place where I do the work the best place they could possibly be. I work on a grooming table because I don't like bending over, but you can work on any surface or in any place where that's the place where all the good stuff happens. That's where we're going to do our work. But before we begin, I make sure they want to be there. And in fact, my dogs nap on the grooming table all the time. And if I walk in the room, they jump up on it because, hey, maybe she'll come over. And I don't think they think that she'll do my nails, but they're thinking maybe she'll come over and we'll have cheese. So they're always ready for that possibility. And that's what I want.

 

(32:29):

I want to build that good emotional reaction to where we are working. And sometimes people ask, "Well, what if I have no choice? I have to do something. It's going to be unpleasant for them. Where should I do it?" I say, "Do it away from the place where you're building the good feelings. Do it somewhere else in your house." If it's a have to be done thing because it's physically absolutely necessary, I try to change the context as much as possible so it doesn't feel like the same and I don't ruin the work that I've done trying to make this place great.

 

Speaker 2 (33:03):

Yeah, that is a great point. Well, we're coming up on time, Dr. Deb, but so before we let you go, I certainly know I want to learn more, so I'm sure our listeners do too. Can you tell us where we can get your book, Cooperative Care, Seven Steps to Stress-Free Husbandry?

 

Speaker 4 (33:19):

Yes. You can get the book on Amazon. So if you put that in, that'll come up there. That's the easiest place to get it, the quickest place to get it. The book has been a good seller, and it's very clear. So anybody can pick it up. That was my whole idea because I've been a college professor for 20 years. I want this to be clear. I want any pet owner to be able to pick up this book and start working through the steps, not need to even have been a dog trainer before, not need to understand anything about dogs. Just do what the book tells you and you'll be in good shape. And so you can get that there. I do teach and do webinars occasionally online at Fenzi Dog Sports Academy. That's where I do all my online work. So you can check their website, which is fenziedogsportsacademy.com.

 

(34:09):

And that will tell you what I'm doing. I actually have a course on nails coming up in a few weeks, so that's the big one for everybody. That's going

 

Speaker 2 (34:16):

To be a popular course.

 

Speaker 4 (34:18):

It usually is. It's the place where you go, "Oh, I need some help." I can give you that help. So come to my course.

 

Speaker 1 (34:28):

Will it work for my one-year-old son? Because we're having the issue trying to trim his nails.

 

Speaker 4 (34:32):

Absolutely. Same idea. Same concept. The cheese in the can

 

Speaker 1 (34:35):

Is an idea I'm bringing back home. And that honestly might work for my son. I think he has that in common with dogs.

 

Speaker 4 (34:42):

I though you were going to ask about a cat because people almost always ask me about cats. And the answer is yes. I've done the same work with cats. I've done it with lots of different animals. We did it with a giraffe once, so yes.

 

Speaker 1 (34:53):

Okay. That's amazing.

 

Speaker 2 (34:56):

Well, Dr. Deb, thank you so much for joining us. We'll make sure to put all those links in the show notes so people can find it.

 

Speaker 4 (35:01):

Thank you so much. I really appreciate the chance to talk about my favorite thing.

 

Speaker 2 (35:05):

Yes. Keep up the great work.

 

Speaker 4 (35:08):

Thanks.

 

Speaker 2 (35:13):

You could tell she makes learning fun, whether it's people learning or teaching your pet.

 

Speaker 1 (35:19):

Sorry. I'm distracted by the fact that my face is on the monitor behind you. I'm seeing myself. Anyway - Looking

 

Speaker 2 (35:28):

In the mirror. Oh, there's

 

Speaker 1 (35:30):

Me. There's you. No, Dr. Deb was great. I really like that she's addressing actual problems. Those problem points, I think is a question we get so much on the show from dog parents. And the fact that there's webinars specific to learning those skills, I think if you are a pet parent and that's a big pain point in your life, it might be worth investing in one of those webinars. So I'd check it out.

 

Speaker 5 (35:55):

The product of the week.

 

Speaker 1 (35:57):

It's time for our product of the week. And I've got another sort of outdoorsy sort of in animal behavior type product here for those dog owners looking for a really good harness that's going to give you solid control over your dog without gripping at the neck or anywhere uncomfortable. It's one of those things we kind of talked about with a lot of dog trainers when you're trying to leash train and you really want to have good control. So this is the easy dog cross check. And it was interesting to me because it is one of the ones that's going to pull sort of on, I guess, would you call that a dog's chest? That front

 

Speaker 3 (36:43):

Area.

 

Speaker 1 (36:43):

That's a dog's chest, right? Yeah. On their chest and underneath to sort of rear them up instead of grabbing anywhere around the neck. And you guys have to look at the pictures because it's interesting because the slip is actually towards the side. And that's because when they start to pull, it's going to rotate the harness and sort of lock the harness in. And so otherwise it's very loose and comfortable for the dog, but when they start to pull, it's just going to tighten. And again, it's not tightening around the neck. It's tightening around the body to secure the dog and give you more control. It only runs at 35 bucks. It comes in a few different colors. It's just like a very simple design. And I've seen these at the dog park all the time. And I think if you saw the picture, Kristen, you'd probably be like, "Oh yeah, that one." So I definitely recommend it when I was doing some research on dog training gear for a friend of mine.

 

(37:42):

This was recommended by a bunch of bloggers and some folks that we've even had on the show in the past. So this gets beyond just my endorsement. So again, that's the easy, easy wide dog crosscheck harness. The link will be in the notes.

 

Speaker 2 (37:59):

Check it out. So I chose a nutrition related product this week since we talked to Dr. Sprinkle. This is a digital measuring spoon. Now it can be used for pet food, which is why I chose it, but you could also use it for other things in cooking. But it's really cool. It's an actual scoop, but it has the little digital readout on the handle that tells you how many grams or milliliters - Oh, it's

 

Speaker 1 (38:26):

Like weight, like a scale.

 

Speaker 2 (38:27):

Yeah. It's a scale. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, I should have said it. I said measuring spoon. It's a measuring scale, shaped like a spoon.

 

Speaker 1 (38:35):

Shaped

 

Speaker 2 (38:35):

Like a spoon. It looks to me like it holds a little more than a cup. But we talked about nutrition and also it's super important to make sure you have portion control with your pets. And this thing will measure wet food, kibble, treats, even supplements. If you use a powdered supplement, it'll measure that too. So this way, if there are multiple people feeding your pet in your home, you can all stick to a certain weight. And it's only, how much is this thing? It's on Amazon for 13 bucks. Super, super cheap price. And yeah, I think I am actually adding this to my cart as we speak, because I think it'll be a handy kitchen tool too.

 

Speaker 1 (39:20):

Yeah. Yeah. Measuring by weight is a thing that the best chefs in the world do and nobody does at home because it's a pain in the butt. It is a pain. It's an absolute pain in the butt. So that's a two for product for pet parent and pet.

 

Speaker 2 (39:39):

Yeah. And chef. Home cook.

 

Speaker 1 (39:40):

And chef. Pet chef. Ratitui.

 

Speaker 2 (39:44):

Pet chef. Q and As.

 

Speaker 1 (39:47):

All right folks, it is time for our favorite part of the show. That's right. We're going to answer two questions from our lovely audience. And I know what you're thinking, lovely audience. How do I get my question answered by Chris and Kristen? Well, it couldn't be easier. Head on over to petsadlife.org/podcast. Scroll on down to the bottom of that page and you'll see a form to submit your question. Or if you're feeling as brave as somebody hiking in shorts this season, tick season. Yeah. This is a long pant hiking year folks. Then you can submit a voice memo and you may hear your question played live on the air. So Kristen.

 

Speaker 2 (40:28):

Yes.

 

Speaker 1 (40:28):

I'm going to ask your question first. And it comes from Mark. Mark from Columbus, Ohio. And Mark asks, "I've watched countless training videos online, but my dog still isn't responding consistently. How can owners know when they're training effectively at home? And what are some common mistakes people make without realizing it?"

 

Speaker 2 (40:52):

Okay. I wish Dr. Jones could have stuck around to answer this question for us, but I'm going to give it my best shot, Mark. So I think the clearest sign that you're training is working is when the command, you get the desired result outside of wherever you trained your dog to do that thing. So for example, if you're teaching your dog basic obedience commands in a quiet kitchen, then it's unlikely that they're just going to automatically respond the same way at the dog park or out for a walk or something like that. So your dog kind of gets. The context is what confuses the pet. So it's important that you train in different areas of the home, inside, outside, under different conditions, because otherwise you kind of taught a dog that when you're in the kitchen and you say sit, they are to sit. You want to teach a behavior, not just a particular context.

 

(41:51):

So that's one thing. And I think we even talked to a trainer. We talked to so many dog trainers. I think we even talked to a trainer that talked about how important it is to teach your dog those commands in different environments. And try short sessions. Some dogs have longer attention spans than others. So we just keep it short, like a little five-minute session, adding those different rooms and excellent treats, like really high value treats. And yeah, that should help you out. So if not, then we're going to have to phone a friend and talk to Deb Jones again.

 

Speaker 1 (42:27):

Excellent advice as always, Kristen.

 

Speaker 2 (42:30):

All right, Chris. So I have a question for you.

 

Speaker 1 (42:32):

Okay.

 

Speaker 2 (42:32):

And this one comes from Jennifer in Seattle. And Jennifer says, "My cat seems stressed by the smallest changes. A new visitor, moving furniture, even bringing home groceries. Why are some cats so sensitive to change? And what can owners do to help them feel more secure and confident?"

 

Speaker 1 (42:52):

That is a great question. And I've talked a lot about this, but I'm going to sprinkle in a new factoid that I've picked up recently, which is why I wanted to take this question. So the answer to why is cats are creatures of routine. Even if they were out in the wild, they are incredibly beholden to the time of day and their appetites and their metabolisms and their instincts. And they like consistent things. And when things change, it typically in the wild represents danger. And so it's their instinct to see change and go, "That's not something I'm ready for. I'm going to go somewhere else now." And it's very difficult to train instinct out of a cat. I think the best thing you could do is make them comfortable. And we talk about this a lot in terms of giving them their own unchanging cavern.

 

(43:44):

But when I see these cats who are very uncomfortable at home and very uncomfortable with guests, one thing that I always strike home is make sure your cat has verticality. All the cats that I know of who are scaredy cats when people come over, they don't have the big cat tree. They don't have the little shelves. So they're panicked because they don't have a place to go where they feel safe. Cats feel safe, high up. They're from the trees, they're little night stalkers. But the little factoid I picked up was make sure that verticality, they could see the entrance to your home, especially if you're in an apartment or condo or one entrance home type situation. And that change is always coming through that door. Give them a good scouting point so they could sort of reconnaissance that area and feel comfortable. And then they'll feel less ambushed and more like the ambusher and they'll feel more empowered.

 

(44:42):

So that's a little factoid I picked up in some recent articles I was reading. So I thought that was really interesting. That's really good one. I like that. Yeah. And it makes a lot of sense based on everybody we've talked to about this kind of stuff.

 

Speaker 2 (44:57):

Exactly.

 

Speaker 1 (44:58):

I hope you find that helpful, Jennifer. Thank you for your question. And that brings us to the end of the episode, but fear not, we'll be back next week.

 

Speaker 2 (45:12):

That's right. Except I won't be back with my lovely new set next week, but I'm working

 

Speaker 1 (45:16):

On it. Yeah. We're going to be moving Kristen Levine to Hollywood, California, where she'll actually be using Jimmy Kimmel's set.

 

Speaker 2 (45:27):

Yeah.

 

Speaker 1 (45:27):

I believe he's the late show host who's in LA.

 

Speaker 2 (45:31):

Yeah.

 

Speaker 1 (45:31):

Because most of them are in New York. He's a fun thing. Yeah,

 

Speaker 2 (45:34):

That's right. Are they still in Burbank for the Tonight Show?

 

Speaker 1 (45:38):

I believe so. Yeah.

 

Speaker 2 (45:39):

Okay.

 

Speaker 1 (45:40):

Yeah. So we'll be borrowing their set for Kristen, is the point I was trying to make. Until then, we'll be back on Tuesday. Check us out on YouTube and dog TV, unleash their fast channel because you should be taking us in beautiful 4K. Otherwise, why the heck did we get all these expensive cameras? Yeah, why did I put on my makeup today? Come on. And I put my makeup on today. Yeah, I should have put some makeup on today. The bags under my eyes are egregious. They're aggressive. Make sure you follow Pet's Ad Life and Dog TV on all of your social medias to stay up to date and get the clips of the episode and view us in beautiful vertical format because that's how the kids are taking things in these days.

 

Speaker 2 (46:25):

These days.

 

Speaker 1 (46:26):

You ever hear these kids watching full movies on TikTok in vertical? Have you seen that?

 

Speaker 2 (46:32):

The weird. Yeah. I don't get it. I don't get it.

 

Speaker 1 (46:34):

Wild.

 

Speaker 2 (46:35):

Hey, I want to wrap it up with tail and tidbit. I'm bringing back the tail and tidbit.

 

Speaker 1 (46:39):

Okay. The tail end tidbits back.

 

Speaker 2 (46:41):

Yeah. So I just wanted to let everybody know that some of the positive reinforcement techniques that Deb Jones talked about today were borrowed from marine mammal trainers. And that's because it's really difficult to muscle a 400 pound dolphin into cooperating. So marine mammal trainers had to get really creative with rewards. So it turns out the same patients that works for dolphins and dolphin trainers can work for you and your dog.

 

Speaker 1 (47:10):

Training with a porpoise.

 

Speaker 2 (47:13):

Oh, that's so difficult.

 

Speaker 1 (47:16):

Ended there. End the episode there.

 

Speaker 2 (47:17):

Okay. We're done.

 

Speaker 1 (47:19):

Pets Ad Life, your guide to the latest in pet trends, products, and the joy of the human animal bond. With Kristen Levine and me, Chris Bonafati, powered by the American Pet Products Association and dog TV.

 

Speaker 5 (47:35):

So what exactly is Pet's Ad Life, you're asking? It's a weekly podcast with two hosts sharing two pet stories, interviewing two amazing guests, recommending two awesome products and answering two questions from the audience. And all this is produced by two major pet brands. I guess you could say is too good to be true. You're right. Check out Pets Ad Life with new episodes every Tuesday.

 

Speaker 1 (48:00):

If you encounter a snake, don't be a Chris, just walk the other way. I

 

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Pets Ad Life, your guide to the latest in pet trends, products, and the joy of the human animal bond with Kristen Levine and me, Chris Bonafati, powered by the American Pet Products Association and dog TV. Hello and welcome to another episode of Pets Ad Life. I am one of your co-hosts, Chris Bonafotti, and joining me as always traveling deep within the jungles of Chile is Kristen Levine. Kristen, you're playing an away game today.

Speaker 2 (00:32):
I am. I am. And I specifically rented this Airbnb just so I could do the show with a video screen just like yours, because you stepped up your set game last week. I did.

Speaker 1 (00:43):
I'm a trendsetter. I'm a trendsetter. I'm really at the forefront of this whole podcasting thing. They're calling me the Steve Jobs of podcasting. Yeah. So listen, that's not me saying that. It's them. Okay. It's them. They're saying that. But hey, we've got a new set over there, an away game set for Kristen, a new set here for Chris, but we're still bringing you the same stuff. We're going to do two stories, two guests. We're going to answer two of your questions. We're going to do two products, the same old pal twosome as always. That's

Speaker 2 (01:21):
Right.

Speaker 1 (01:22):
For these adult days of summer.

Speaker 2 (01:25):
I got to wish my sister happy birthday. We were releasing this show on July 21st. It's her birthday. Yeah. It's not a special number birthday, but yeah, she's younger. She always likes to point that out to me. How much younger she is than me.

Speaker 1 (01:43):
Well, she couldn't be what? If you're 35, she's probably what, like 32, 33? Yeah, 32.

Speaker 2 (01:49):
It's her 32nd birthday ready.

Speaker 1 (01:51):
Happy 32nd birthday to Kristen's sister. Kristen and Chris present story time. All right. And kicking it off with story time. Kristen, do you want me to put you on the spot? Sure.

Speaker 2 (02:07):
Sure.

Speaker 1 (02:08):
I'll go

Speaker 2 (02:08):
First. Yeah. I found an interesting story. This is a potential tax credit coming to New Jersey Pet Parents. Yeah. So a New Jersey assembly bill, the bill number is 4995, was introduced by Assemblyman Alex. Oh, I don't know how to pronounce this. Anyway, it would give pet owners up to $900 in state income tax credits. That's $300 for just general costs like food and supplies and up to $600 for vet bills. Yeah. Yeah. And apparently New York is weighing a very similar bill. So hopefully the bill will get voted. It's not scheduled for a vote yet, but that's got to be coming up soon. But I thought that was really exciting news because if this gets passed in Jersey and then New York, then hopefully before you know it, other states will have this tax credit. And this is, just to clarify, it's an actual dollar for dollar tax cut.

(03:12):
It's not like a deduction. So yeah, 900 bucks. We could all use 900 bucks in our pocket.

Speaker 1 (03:18):
Sounds like a write off. And I love a write off. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (03:20):
Who doesn't love a good write off?

Speaker 1 (03:22):
Who doesn't love a write off, right? You just write it off. You get to write off your pet. How about that?

Speaker 2 (03:27):
Exactly. All right. What's your story?

Speaker 1 (03:30):
I want to talk about ticks. It's been a terrible tick summer so far. I was playing golf the other day and found a tick on me before it managed to bite. But this wasn't even tall grasses. This was like a well maintained golf course. And that's how I know it's really bad. So I just wanted everyone to know that your pet is never 100% safe. Even if you're using flea and tick medication or the collars or something, they're like 99% effective. And in a year where there's so much tick volume, if you've got one of those outdoor dogs who's really going to head into the woods and have a bit of an adventure or if you're hiking often and things like that, you should still be doing tick checks. So the CDC

(04:26):
Recommends doing tick checks on your pets, especially cats. And between their toes is where they're saying is like the spot that gets missed the most. So if you have an outdoor cat and they've been in the woods, you're going to pick them up and you're going to press your little thumb into the center of their paw. It's going to relax their muscles and painlessly expend their claws and loosen up their little toe beans and just take a little peak in there. You don't have to get your hands in, just take a little peak and check for those ticks. So that's just a PSA style story from Chris today.

Speaker 2 (05:05):
And I have a related story, kind of a gross story. Well, first of all, you were talking about checking your cats and dogs. It's so tough to see ticks on a black or a dark colored dog or cat. So true. They've really, really, really got to be vigilant. But listen to this. I'm out of town for a week. I've been in Florida. And Paul called me the other day and he said he was taking tulip for a walk. And she started shaking her paw. And he looks down and there was a tick. And as he's going to grab the tick, she put her head down and she ate it.

Speaker 1 (05:37):
Hey. Apex predator.

Speaker 2 (05:39):
Right?

Speaker 1 (05:40):
Apex predator. Well, that's why I always. There's been a big resurgence up here in the Northeast in bringing the bat population back because they had found their way into everybody's attic when I was growing up in the '90s and through the new millennia and to the 2010s, they called all the bats. And now the mosquitoes and ticks are the worst they've ever been. And what do bats mostly eat? Mosquitoes. It's like mosquitoes, flies and ticks. Bring

Speaker 2 (06:07):
Back the bats.

Speaker 1 (06:08):
Bring back the bats. Yes. That is just another Batman bias of mine. Beyond the leash, exploring the untold stories of pet passion and professionalism. Joining us now is Dr. Megan Sprinkle, a board certified veterinary nutritionist, speaker, consultant, writer, and educator dedicated to advancing pet health through science-based nutrition. Throughout her career, she has worked across clinical practice, academia, industry, and consulting, helping veterinarians and pet owners better understand the critical role nutrition plays in long-term health and wellness. Currently serving as head of veterinary affairs at Golden Child, a fresh dog food company focused on proactive nutrition and strengthening the human animal bond. Dr. Sprinkle is passionate about making veterinary nutrition more accessible and actionable for pet families. In addition to her work, she advises emerging pet health companies, speaks nationally on veterinary topics, and is known for her innovative forward-thinking approach to improving pet care through education, technology and collaboration.

(07:09):
Dr. Sprinkle, thank you so much for taking some time out of your day.

Speaker 3 (07:13):
Thank you. That was an amazing introduction.

Speaker 1 (07:15):
I'd love to say I wrote it myself, but I just yell the words into the microphone. But wow, what an impressive resume. Pet owners receive nutrition advice from veterinarians, from social media, from pet stores, from breeders, from their strange uncles. From us. Yeah. From us who might also be their strange uncle. Why has pet nutrition become so confusing? Why is there so much conflicting information? And where should pet owners go to get the most trustworthy stuff?

Speaker 3 (07:49):
Yeah. I think we are in the age of overinformation and you can pretty much find a different answer just depending on where you look. And so I think that's inside and outside of pet nutrition. But I think one of the reasons why it's really confusing is that ultimately, while yes, it's interesting on what all dogs need and all cats need, what's really important is what your dog needs and what your cat needs. And so a lot of the information out there can be very general. And so ultimately it's best to figure out what are the unique needs that your cat and dog have that are going to be helpful in finding the right diet for your pet. And that really comes down to between you and your veterinary team, they know your pet the best and they're really going to help set you up with knowing some specific things to look for regarding on choosing a diet.

(08:46):
And that could be knowing your pet's body condition score. So you know maybe what's a good calorie target to look for specific health needs like joint support, those kinds of things. So I think that really helps is kind of eliminating some of that noise and honing in on what does my pet specifically need? And I think that's a much better starting place.

Speaker 2 (09:08):
Yeah. You mentioned obesity, Dr. Sprinkle. It's one of the biggest health issues facing pets today. It's so common. Why is the excess weight such a concern? And what are some signs that owners might not realize that their pet is overweight?

Speaker 3 (09:26):
Yeah. Great questions. So let me get a little nerdy just for a second. Please. But I think it helps.

Speaker 1 (09:33):
Permission granted.

Speaker 3 (09:35):
Awesome. I think it helps understand when you look at that excess fat on the body, it's not benign just sitting there doing nothing. It's actually a state of inflammation. So it makes sense that obesity is so linked to all these other health concerns and risks. So obesity increases your risk for joint disease is one really obvious one, but we also see connections between increased risk in cancer, in heart disease and other issues. And so it's really important that it's not just cute, which it might be for some dogs, but it really is a health concern that we need to think about in a long term scenario. Your second question about what might be something that a pet parent might miss. Kind of going back to your first point is there are, according to statistics, more overweight pets than ideal weight pets. So our perception of what is, maybe it shouldn't be normal, right?

(10:40):
Of what is appropriate is a little off. So that may be one thing to acknowledge is that on all the more to talk with your veterinary team to make sure that your particular pet is on track. The other thing, I will admit, a lot of our pets are very fluffy. And so like on a day-to-day basis, you may not obviously see a drastic increase in weight until maybe you're kind of far along. And one additional pound on a miniature poodle is a little bit different than if we put on one pound. So it can happen pretty quickly. So again, making sure that you're talking with your veterinary team, proactively bring it up. I love my colleagues, but don't wait for them to bring it up. Just go ahead and proactively ask about it and work with them to make sure that you're on the right track with your pet.

Speaker 1 (11:33):
Yeah. Let's talk about diets with dogs and cats. And you mentioned a stat that I also love to bring up that there's more obese cats and dogs in the United States than ideal weight cats and dogs. And I think a lot of pet parents have tried to get that weight down on their pet and they end up failing. So talk to us a little bit about how to create a sustainable dieting plan for our dog or cat and get them down to that ideal weight.

Speaker 3 (12:06):
Yeah. Well, ultimately, if you are having trouble, sorry to sound like a broken record, make sure you are talking to your vet. Yes. And a lot of times, because again, that very constant measuring, don't do it like, okay, we're going to go on a diet and then I'll check in with my vet in a year. That's way too long to wait to check in and make sure you're on the right track. A lot of the ones, especially that have trouble losing weight, really do need a very special diet that's specifically designed for weight loss. So it's worth the investment. You're going to get to where you want to be safer as well as at appropriate time. So just like looking at the diet from that perspective, do you need to try another diet? Doesn't mean necessarily that they have to be on that diet for life.

(12:57):
But in the meantime, to get to that ideal weight, it's probably that might be the best option for your pet. And then I will call out sometimes these are the sneaky things that come up are like the additional treats. And if you're sharing your popcorn on movie night and all those sneaky little calories that sneak in there, we need to make sure that we're keeping account of those special things as well.

Speaker 2 (13:23):
Yes. Well, I'm going to make sure my husband hears this episode because -

Speaker 1 (13:27):
He's guilty.

Speaker 2 (13:29):
We have this issue in our house and I was actually going to ask you about this. I know that we use treats as a way to bond with our pets. And my husband's love language is food. So how can I delicately help him help her by factoring in the treats that he loves to give her without it being ultimately being too many calories in a day?

Speaker 3 (13:57):
Yes. I completely understand. I have a dog myself and watching my dog get excited about something that I give her is, it does impact you.You feel so good. And so sometimes that is, if you can associate that with meal time too, is that if they get excited about the meal, then we don't feel like we have to overly treat maybe. But I do believe in making sure that as veterinarians, we call it the treat allowance. I think it is good to vocalize that that is important. It is part of bonding and that's great. But just make sure that you know how much you are feeding in that. So I know this doesn't sound like a lot of fun, but if you're like, "Man, popcorn time with my dog is really important to me," then let's look at, okay, how many calories is in a cup of popcorn?

(14:51):
And does that work with your dog? Is that within about the 10% that we kind of give as the treat allowance? And you can know that that's okay. And we just minimize all those other things. So what's the priority? Start there. Know how many calories that is for your pet. And then just make it part of the feeding tradition. So it does not have to be boring. You don't have to give away everything. Just be a little bit more mindful about what it all actually means for your pet.

Speaker 1 (15:23):
That's great advice. I want to pivot a little bit to supplements because they're incredibly popular. There's so many different products on the market making all sorts of different kinds of claims. Do you have supplements that you consider like there's a lot of science backing this particular type? And what should pet owners be aware of before deciding to add supplements to their pet's diet?

Speaker 3 (15:50):
Yeah. One disclaimer, there's pros and cons to this, but the pet supplement industry has a lot less regulation. So it's just something to be mindful of when you are going to select something for your pet. I said that there's pros and cons. I'll say a pro because this comes up as someone who is in the innovation space in the pet industry, that there are some really great nutritional, beneficial ingredients out there that AFCO doesn't have approved for complete and balanced foods. And so as much as I want to put these wonderful data backed kind of things in the food, I can't legally because AFCO hasn't gone through the process to make them approve for food. So again, there are pros and cons to having this supplement route to getting some of these nutrition needs to your pet. I'll give you two examples. One might be really boring and I'm sorry, but I do love them and they are really boring.

Speaker 1 (16:56):
Org is good.

Speaker 3 (16:58):
And that's omega-3 fatty acids. Very specifically coming from marine sources because that we know is bringing in the EPA and DHA that has all those wonderful anti-inflammatory and all the good benefits there. So that as a nutritionist has been tried and true, one of my favorites, heavily researched backed. You talked about washouts. It still is a source of dietary fat. And so it is still good to work with your veterinarian to make sure you're accounting for what might be coming through the food to get the right amount for your pet and their specific needs. So that's my boring one. One of the newer ones that is gaining a lot, a lot of data, and it's just super exciting because it also overcomes some of the challenges with probiotics are postbiotics. So this one might be a newer one for a lot of people, but if you start to look, they're coming up more and more actually both in human nutrition and pet nutrition.

(18:07):
And some of the benefits are like all that you think about with encouraging a healthy microbiome population. This helps getting all those benefits. But unlike probiotics, which are actual live organisms, postbiotics are not alive. So I don't have to worry about keeping them alive throughout the process and making sure that actually gets to the GI tract to do all the wonderful things we want it to do. So these postbiotics kind of overcome a lot of the challenges with, again, all the really cool benefits that we like about supporting a really healthy microbiome. So that's hopefully a newer interested one.

Speaker 1 (18:47):
That's new. That the first time I heard postbiotics. And in my head I'm like, there's a post Malone joke in there somewhere. You'll get there eventually, Chris.

Speaker 2 (18:57):
And actually we're coming up on time already, Dr. Sprinkle. So can you give us one closing bit of advice for every pet parent regarding nutrition and then tell us where we can follow your work as a nutritionist?

Speaker 3 (19:11):
Yeah. Oh goodness. As you could probably tell, I could give a lot of thoughts and advice, but you know what? You' already

Speaker 2 (19:17):
Dropped some great value bombs.

Speaker 3 (19:20):
Thank you. I think we all want our pets to live as long as possible and that every day that they do live is really healthy and happy. And so really, again, back to data back to the best thing that I can offer for that is keeping your pet at a good body condition score. So it really is important to talk with your veterinary team about keeping your pets at a healthy weight. And so ultimately, if that's what you're looking for, that's the best piece of advice I have.

Speaker 2 (19:48):
Excellent. Excellent. And can we follow you on social or is there

Speaker 3 (19:53):
A

Speaker 2 (19:53):
Website you'd like us to check out?

Speaker 3 (19:55):
Sure. You can find me on most platforms. I tend to hang out on LinkedIn the most, but you can also look up My Golden Child too and follow us to see all the fun things that we're doing there.

Speaker 1 (20:06):
Awesome. Well, thank you so much for taking some time out of your day and giving us this awesome information. I've learned quite a few tidbits. I'm sure our listeners are getting their money's worth on this podcast they listen to for free. Yes. But thank you so much for joining us today. Thank

Speaker 3 (20:27):
You very much for having me.

Speaker 1 (20:31):
Dr. Sprinkle was awesome. I feel like I learned so much, which is as we gain episodes here, it becomes more and more difficult for me to gain new information. But I learned like three or four new things from those 15 minutes, which was really awesome.

Speaker 2 (20:48):
Your takeaway was about postbiotics, right?

Speaker 1 (20:50):
Postbiotics. Yeah. I'd never heard that I knew about the antibiotics and about the probiotics. And that seems like it's a set duality. You know what I mean? That there can only be two. Now there's postbiotics and I'm looking forward to seeing what the industry does with that kind of new information.

Speaker 2 (21:10):
I'm delighted to introduce our guest today, Dr. Deb Jones. She's a dog trainer, an author, an educator, and a psychologist who's spent more than 30 years studying learning, behavior and the relationship between people and their dogs. With an academic background in behavioral and social psychology, Deb has become one of the respected voices in positive reinforcement training and cooperative care, helping dog owners better understand how animals learn and how to reduce fear and stress in everyday handling situations. Over the course of Dr. Deb's career, she is trained and competed with a variety of breeds in obedience, agility, rally, and other dog sports while also teaching thousands of students around the world. She is the author of numerous books, including Cooperative Care: Seven Steps to Stress-Free Husbandry: A Groundbreaking Guide that helps pet parents teach dogs to willingly participate in things like grooming, nail trims, vet exams, and other routine procedures.

(22:11):
I'm so excited to talk to you today, Dr. Deb.

Speaker 4 (22:14):
Oh, thank you so much. I really appreciate you asking me to be here. I am always happy to talk about dog stuff. Obviously all happy to talk about dog stuff. It makes it sound like I've done a lot and now I feel kind of tired actually.

Speaker 1 (22:29):
We get that a lot actually.

Speaker 2 (22:31):
You have been busy, but you're going to help -

Speaker 4 (22:33):
It's been a lot of years.

Speaker 2 (22:36):
Now you're going to educate us and our audience today. You have such a unique background, both as a psychologist and a dog trainer. So how has your understanding of human behavior influenced the way you approach dog training?

Speaker 4 (22:50):
I think that's what got me into dog training was just the study of behavior in general. I was really fascinated back when I was in college, the whole idea of behavior being predictable and that we really could have a very big influence on behavior. And actually what I've discovered over the years is it's a lot easier to change the behavior of animals than it is to change the behavior of people. I believe that. People are hard. People are difficult. Animals are straightforward and fairly simple. Once you figure out what they want, you've got it. It's pretty easy. But with people, there's a lot of complications involved. Well,

Speaker 1 (23:33):
If you figure out how to change people's behavior, I think you're really beyond to something. Yes. I think a lot of pet owners think that dog training is about teaching commands, but I think it's way beyond that. What do you think people misunderstand most about how our dogs learn?

Speaker 4 (23:51):
I think that, and this was true of me as well in the beginning, the whole idea of training is to get them to do what I want. That's the whole goal without thinking about what they want or what they need. Just if I can get them to do the things I want, they'll fit into my life fine and everything will be okay. And happily I've seen change over the years. Now we are becoming much more concerned with the dogs getting their needs met and with it being more of a cooperative relationship rather than I tell you what to do when you do it. Very one-way street, which is unfortunately some people still follow that paradigm. But for a lot of us, the idea is I want it to be more of a working partnership and I want whatever animal I'm working with to be happy to work with me, to want to work with me, to be comfortable with what I'm asking them to do.

(24:45):
And that all kind of evolved into this idea of cooperative care rather than pressure or force to get them to comply with what I wanted. It's that I can work on getting you to cooperate with what I want you to do.

Speaker 2 (24:59):
Well, and you are widely known for your work in cooperative care, which is a new term for a lot of pet parents, I would think. So what exactly is cooperative care? Why has it become such an important concept in modern dog training and modern life

Speaker 4 (25:15):
Dogs? It's becoming a thing. It's becoming a big thing. And it all started because I had a dog who hated going to the vet. For years, my dogs went to the vet, they didn't love it, but they didn't hate it. And we just did what we had to do. It wasn't pleasant, but it wasn't horrible. And then I had one dog who decided, no, absolutely not. I am not letting them touch me. And she was very, very clear border colleague. Star was her name. And she was very clear that she was not going to be examined and they were not going to do things to her. And I could tell it came out of fear that she was uncomfortable. She was afraid. She felt pressured. Strangers are coming at her with strange objects and she's not having it. There's just no way. Most of my other dogs would be like, "Okay, whatever." And a lot of dogs are fine with it.

(26:03):
But when they're not, they're really not. And I knew that I had to find ways to make her comfortable because she had hopefully 14 or 15 years of veterinary care in her life. And so I started working, going back to the things that I knew from learning theories, especially learning how to be comfortable and learning to relax and learning to trust that things were going to turn out okay. And so that trust is hard to build and it's easy to lose.

Speaker 1 (26:38):
I think that's a great point. And I think in the introduction, Kristen listed things like nail trimming and grooming. And you're touching on the vet visits. And I think all the pet parents at home, they want to know the secret to building that trust because those are the pain points in their lives and their relationship with their dog. So what are some things that pet parents can do now to start building that trust to make these important health related things easier on the dog? Yes,

Speaker 4 (27:10):
Because these are things that are going to have to happen. Yes. It's not like we have choice in a lot of them, but I start out just getting my dogs used to being touched and handled. And that's different than petting. Everybody thinks my dog likes to be petted and they do, most of them do. But it's a whole different universe when I'm doing something where I have a goal and I'm physically handling you in some way, especially if it might be uncomfortable. So we start with. Oh, there we go. We start with physical handling and then we move. He's like a cat. He's all over the place. We move from there to starting to work on pretending, simulating procedures that are common and likely to be done. And I break things down. I go way back. People say, okay, I need to do my dog's nails.

(28:00):
So they grab the dog's foot and they grab the clippers and the dog fights. And then they're in a bad situation that they have just made worse. And so now what are we going to do next? Are we going to use more force, more pressure? That's not what I want to do. Again, I keep thinking for the long term, I don't want to do that for 15 years. I don't want to fight with my dog over what needs to be done. So we go back and we, again, build that trust. When I touch you, it's going to be pleasant. It's not going to be uncomfortable. I'm not going to push you beyond your comfort zone or your limits, but we'll move slowly to more challenging things. So touching the leg and they're comfortable with that. Touching the paw, we're comfortable with that. Picking up the paw, are we comfortable with that?

(28:45):
And at every step, I'm using high value reinforcers. My dogs like all kinds of foods, so they make it easy. So I use cheese is like cheese in a can is the thing. Sweet cheese in a can. If I bring that out, I could do surgery on them and they'd be okay.

(29:05):
So we do a lot of that work and we do it all before we need it. That's kind of a key for me. Because once you've had the bad experiences, now you're in a hole and you have to work your way out. Well,

Speaker 2 (29:16):
Yeah. And that's actually, you're getting to my next question is I understand how that really works well when you're preparing your dog or your cat for a vet visit or a nail trim. But what if you have a dog like my tulip who is already unfortunately terrified of nail trims? Can you reverse that fear and rebuild that trust? You

Speaker 4 (29:40):
Can. The great thing about learning is that we can always relearn new things. We can't unlearn. We can't take away what they already know, but we can make a fresh start and we can make it better. And so yeah, I go way back to what I say is baby steps. I go back to what I do in the very beginning. With a puppy. And sometimes it's things like, okay, they don't like the nail tremors. So I start with just showing them the nail tremors and throwing them a cookie. Show the trimmers, throw a cookie. Show the trimmers, throw a cookie. And they're like, bring out the clippers because every time I see them, there's cookies. Yeah. And they are good now. And so I'm trying to do what we call conditioned emotional response, which is making the site of something better and making it a happy thing instead of a scary thing.

(30:28):
So sort of like the feeling you have when you go to the dentist, that's not a good emotional response for most of us. And so our dogs have that emotional response to the things that we are trying to do to them, to the tools that we're using. And we want to go back. We want to make it better. And we can do that through, I use a lot of food because my dogs are food motivated. For some dogs, it's play or toys, but it's something they want that we can introduce into our handling sessions and into our training sessions that makes it better for them. So that's where we start when we go back. But I go way back. I always say, go back to the point where the dog is comfortable, not where you think they should be comfortable, but go back to the actual place where your dog is comfortable and start working forward from there.

(31:19):
And it's going to be further back than you think. It's not going to be touching the foot. It's going to be maybe just moving your hand towards your dog and working on that for a while first. So always backwards to move forward. Do you think

Speaker 1 (31:31):
The environment that they're in has anything to do with it? Should you try and trim your dog's nails in the same place in your home so they get all that positive retention? Do you think that plays into it a bit?

Speaker 4 (31:45):
That's an excellent question. Context matters a lot to animals where something happens. And I actually work very hard on making the place where I do the work the best place they could possibly be. I work on a grooming table because I don't like bending over, but you can work on any surface or in any place where that's the place where all the good stuff happens. That's where we're going to do our work. But before we begin, I make sure they want to be there. And in fact, my dogs nap on the grooming table all the time. And if I walk in the room, they jump up on it because, hey, maybe she'll come over. And I don't think they think that she'll do my nails, but they're thinking maybe she'll come over and we'll have cheese. So they're always ready for that possibility. And that's what I want.

(32:29):
I want to build that good emotional reaction to where we are working. And sometimes people ask, "Well, what if I have no choice? I have to do something. It's going to be unpleasant for them. Where should I do it?" I say, "Do it away from the place where you're building the good feelings. Do it somewhere else in your house." If it's a have to be done thing because it's physically absolutely necessary, I try to change the context as much as possible so it doesn't feel like the same and I don't ruin the work that I've done trying to make this place great.

Speaker 2 (33:03):
Yeah, that is a great point. Well, we're coming up on time, Dr. Deb, but so before we let you go, I certainly know I want to learn more, so I'm sure our listeners do too. Can you tell us where we can get your book, Cooperative Care, Seven Steps to Stress-Free Husbandry?

Speaker 4 (33:19):
Yes. You can get the book on Amazon. So if you put that in, that'll come up there. That's the easiest place to get it, the quickest place to get it. The book has been a good seller, and it's very clear. So anybody can pick it up. That was my whole idea because I've been a college professor for 20 years. I want this to be clear. I want any pet owner to be able to pick up this book and start working through the steps, not need to even have been a dog trainer before, not need to understand anything about dogs. Just do what the book tells you and you'll be in good shape. And so you can get that there. I do teach and do webinars occasionally online at Fenzi Dog Sports Academy. That's where I do all my online work. So you can check their website, which is fenziedogsportsacademy.com.

(34:09):
And that will tell you what I'm doing. I actually have a course on nails coming up in a few weeks, so that's the big one for everybody. That's going

Speaker 2 (34:16):
To be a popular course.

Speaker 4 (34:18):
It usually is. It's the place where you go, "Oh, I need some help." I can give you that help. So come to my course.

Speaker 1 (34:28):
Will it work for my one-year-old son? Because we're having the issue trying to trim his nails.

Speaker 4 (34:32):
Absolutely. Same idea. Same concept. The cheese in the can

Speaker 1 (34:35):
Is an idea I'm bringing back home. And that honestly might work for my son. I think he has that in common with dogs.

Speaker 4 (34:42):
I though you were going to ask about a cat because people almost always ask me about cats. And the answer is yes. I've done the same work with cats. I've done it with lots of different animals. We did it with a giraffe once, so yes.

Speaker 1 (34:53):
Okay. That's amazing.

Speaker 2 (34:56):
Well, Dr. Deb, thank you so much for joining us. We'll make sure to put all those links in the show notes so people can find it.

Speaker 4 (35:01):
Thank you so much. I really appreciate the chance to talk about my favorite thing.

Speaker 2 (35:05):
Yes. Keep up the great work.

Speaker 4 (35:08):
Thanks.

Speaker 2 (35:13):
You could tell she makes learning fun, whether it's people learning or teaching your pet.

Speaker 1 (35:19):
Sorry. I'm distracted by the fact that my face is on the monitor behind you. I'm seeing myself. Anyway - Looking

Speaker 2 (35:28):
In the mirror. Oh, there's

Speaker 1 (35:30):
Me. There's you. No, Dr. Deb was great. I really like that she's addressing actual problems. Those problem points, I think is a question we get so much on the show from dog parents. And the fact that there's webinars specific to learning those skills, I think if you are a pet parent and that's a big pain point in your life, it might be worth investing in one of those webinars. So I'd check it out.

Speaker 5 (35:55):
The product of the week.

Speaker 1 (35:57):
It's time for our product of the week. And I've got another sort of outdoorsy sort of in animal behavior type product here for those dog owners looking for a really good harness that's going to give you solid control over your dog without gripping at the neck or anywhere uncomfortable. It's one of those things we kind of talked about with a lot of dog trainers when you're trying to leash train and you really want to have good control. So this is the easy dog cross check. And it was interesting to me because it is one of the ones that's going to pull sort of on, I guess, would you call that a dog's chest? That front

Speaker 3 (36:43):
Area.

Speaker 1 (36:43):
That's a dog's chest, right? Yeah. On their chest and underneath to sort of rear them up instead of grabbing anywhere around the neck. And you guys have to look at the pictures because it's interesting because the slip is actually towards the side. And that's because when they start to pull, it's going to rotate the harness and sort of lock the harness in. And so otherwise it's very loose and comfortable for the dog, but when they start to pull, it's just going to tighten. And again, it's not tightening around the neck. It's tightening around the body to secure the dog and give you more control. It only runs at 35 bucks. It comes in a few different colors. It's just like a very simple design. And I've seen these at the dog park all the time. And I think if you saw the picture, Kristen, you'd probably be like, "Oh yeah, that one." So I definitely recommend it when I was doing some research on dog training gear for a friend of mine.

(37:42):
This was recommended by a bunch of bloggers and some folks that we've even had on the show in the past. So this gets beyond just my endorsement. So again, that's the easy, easy wide dog crosscheck harness. The link will be in the notes.

Speaker 2 (37:59):
Check it out. So I chose a nutrition related product this week since we talked to Dr. Sprinkle. This is a digital measuring spoon. Now it can be used for pet food, which is why I chose it, but you could also use it for other things in cooking. But it's really cool. It's an actual scoop, but it has the little digital readout on the handle that tells you how many grams or milliliters - Oh, it's

Speaker 1 (38:26):
Like weight, like a scale.

Speaker 2 (38:27):
Yeah. It's a scale. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, I should have said it. I said measuring spoon. It's a measuring scale, shaped like a spoon.

Speaker 1 (38:35):
Shaped

Speaker 2 (38:35):
Like a spoon. It looks to me like it holds a little more than a cup. But we talked about nutrition and also it's super important to make sure you have portion control with your pets. And this thing will measure wet food, kibble, treats, even supplements. If you use a powdered supplement, it'll measure that too. So this way, if there are multiple people feeding your pet in your home, you can all stick to a certain weight. And it's only, how much is this thing? It's on Amazon for 13 bucks. Super, super cheap price. And yeah, I think I am actually adding this to my cart as we speak, because I think it'll be a handy kitchen tool too.

Speaker 1 (39:20):
Yeah. Yeah. Measuring by weight is a thing that the best chefs in the world do and nobody does at home because it's a pain in the butt. It is a pain. It's an absolute pain in the butt. So that's a two for product for pet parent and pet.

Speaker 2 (39:39):
Yeah. And chef. Home cook.

Speaker 1 (39:40):
And chef. Pet chef. Ratitui.

Speaker 2 (39:44):
Pet chef. Q and As.

Speaker 1 (39:47):
All right folks, it is time for our favorite part of the show. That's right. We're going to answer two questions from our lovely audience. And I know what you're thinking, lovely audience. How do I get my question answered by Chris and Kristen? Well, it couldn't be easier. Head on over to petsadlife.org/podcast. Scroll on down to the bottom of that page and you'll see a form to submit your question. Or if you're feeling as brave as somebody hiking in shorts this season, tick season. Yeah. This is a long pant hiking year folks. Then you can submit a voice memo and you may hear your question played live on the air. So Kristen.

Speaker 2 (40:28):
Yes.

Speaker 1 (40:28):
I'm going to ask your question first. And it comes from Mark. Mark from Columbus, Ohio. And Mark asks, "I've watched countless training videos online, but my dog still isn't responding consistently. How can owners know when they're training effectively at home? And what are some common mistakes people make without realizing it?"

Speaker 2 (40:52):
Okay. I wish Dr. Jones could have stuck around to answer this question for us, but I'm going to give it my best shot, Mark. So I think the clearest sign that you're training is working is when the command, you get the desired result outside of wherever you trained your dog to do that thing. So for example, if you're teaching your dog basic obedience commands in a quiet kitchen, then it's unlikely that they're just going to automatically respond the same way at the dog park or out for a walk or something like that. So your dog kind of gets. The context is what confuses the pet. So it's important that you train in different areas of the home, inside, outside, under different conditions, because otherwise you kind of taught a dog that when you're in the kitchen and you say sit, they are to sit. You want to teach a behavior, not just a particular context.

(41:51):
So that's one thing. And I think we even talked to a trainer. We talked to so many dog trainers. I think we even talked to a trainer that talked about how important it is to teach your dog those commands in different environments. And try short sessions. Some dogs have longer attention spans than others. So we just keep it short, like a little five-minute session, adding those different rooms and excellent treats, like really high value treats. And yeah, that should help you out. So if not, then we're going to have to phone a friend and talk to Deb Jones again.

Speaker 1 (42:27):
Excellent advice as always, Kristen.

Speaker 2 (42:30):
All right, Chris. So I have a question for you.

Speaker 1 (42:32):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (42:32):
And this one comes from Jennifer in Seattle. And Jennifer says, "My cat seems stressed by the smallest changes. A new visitor, moving furniture, even bringing home groceries. Why are some cats so sensitive to change? And what can owners do to help them feel more secure and confident?"

Speaker 1 (42:52):
That is a great question. And I've talked a lot about this, but I'm going to sprinkle in a new factoid that I've picked up recently, which is why I wanted to take this question. So the answer to why is cats are creatures of routine. Even if they were out in the wild, they are incredibly beholden to the time of day and their appetites and their metabolisms and their instincts. And they like consistent things. And when things change, it typically in the wild represents danger. And so it's their instinct to see change and go, "That's not something I'm ready for. I'm going to go somewhere else now." And it's very difficult to train instinct out of a cat. I think the best thing you could do is make them comfortable. And we talk about this a lot in terms of giving them their own unchanging cavern.

(43:44):
But when I see these cats who are very uncomfortable at home and very uncomfortable with guests, one thing that I always strike home is make sure your cat has verticality. All the cats that I know of who are scaredy cats when people come over, they don't have the big cat tree. They don't have the little shelves. So they're panicked because they don't have a place to go where they feel safe. Cats feel safe, high up. They're from the trees, they're little night stalkers. But the little factoid I picked up was make sure that verticality, they could see the entrance to your home, especially if you're in an apartment or condo or one entrance home type situation. And that change is always coming through that door. Give them a good scouting point so they could sort of reconnaissance that area and feel comfortable. And then they'll feel less ambushed and more like the ambusher and they'll feel more empowered.

(44:42):
So that's a little factoid I picked up in some recent articles I was reading. So I thought that was really interesting. That's really good one. I like that. Yeah. And it makes a lot of sense based on everybody we've talked to about this kind of stuff.

Speaker 2 (44:57):
Exactly.

Speaker 1 (44:58):
I hope you find that helpful, Jennifer. Thank you for your question. And that brings us to the end of the episode, but fear not, we'll be back next week.

Speaker 2 (45:12):
That's right. Except I won't be back with my lovely new set next week, but I'm working

Speaker 1 (45:16):
On it. Yeah. We're going to be moving Kristen Levine to Hollywood, California, where she'll actually be using Jimmy Kimmel's set.

Speaker 2 (45:27):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (45:27):
I believe he's the late show host who's in LA.

Speaker 2 (45:31):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (45:31):
Because most of them are in New York. He's a fun thing. Yeah,

Speaker 2 (45:34):
That's right. Are they still in Burbank for the Tonight Show?

Speaker 1 (45:38):
I believe so. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (45:39):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (45:40):
Yeah. So we'll be borrowing their set for Kristen, is the point I was trying to make. Until then, we'll be back on Tuesday. Check us out on YouTube and dog TV, unleash their fast channel because you should be taking us in beautiful 4K. Otherwise, why the heck did we get all these expensive cameras? Yeah, why did I put on my makeup today? Come on. And I put my makeup on today. Yeah, I should have put some makeup on today. The bags under my eyes are egregious. They're aggressive. Make sure you follow Pet's Ad Life and Dog TV on all of your social medias to stay up to date and get the clips of the episode and view us in beautiful vertical format because that's how the kids are taking things in these days.

Speaker 2 (46:25):
These days.

Speaker 1 (46:26):
You ever hear these kids watching full movies on TikTok in vertical? Have you seen that?

Speaker 2 (46:32):
The weird. Yeah. I don't get it. I don't get it.

Speaker 1 (46:34):
Wild.

Speaker 2 (46:35):
Hey, I want to wrap it up with tail and tidbit. I'm bringing back the tail and tidbit.

Speaker 1 (46:39):
Okay. The tail end tidbits back.

Speaker 2 (46:41):
Yeah. So I just wanted to let everybody know that some of the positive reinforcement techniques that Deb Jones talked about today were borrowed from marine mammal trainers. And that's because it's really difficult to muscle a 400 pound dolphin into cooperating. So marine mammal trainers had to get really creative with rewards. So it turns out the same patients that works for dolphins and dolphin trainers can work for you and your dog.

Speaker 1 (47:10):
Training with a porpoise.

Speaker 2 (47:13):
Oh, that's so difficult.

Speaker 1 (47:16):
Ended there. End the episode there.

Speaker 2 (47:17):
Okay. We're done.

Speaker 1 (47:19):
Pets Ad Life, your guide to the latest in pet trends, products, and the joy of the human animal bond. With Kristen Levine and me, Chris Bonafati, powered by the American Pet Products Association and dog TV.

Speaker 5 (47:35):
So what exactly is Pet's Ad Life, you're asking? It's a weekly podcast with two hosts sharing two pet stories, interviewing two amazing guests, recommending two awesome products and answering two questions from the audience. And all this is produced by two major pet brands. I guess you could say is too good to be true. You're right. Check out Pets Ad Life with new episodes every Tuesday.

Speaker 1 (48:00):
If you encounter a snake, don't be a Chris, just walk the other way.